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Castable Refractory Products (VT600)

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  • wotavidone
    replied
    Note, if the stuff they are offering you is the insulating castable it is gunned in place, with phosphoric acid added at the nozzle to provide the reaction for the formation of the foam.
    As david s says, castables are usually CAC plus aggregates. I would guess that in this particular product the aggregates would be very small size so as to promote and assist the foaming.
    If I were in driving distance of that supplier, I would be sorely tempted to grab one $15 bag, mix some and make a trial cast without the phosphoric acid. Seems to be a mix of alumina, silica and CAC, without the air bubbles it might be a good dense castable.
    So I'd fill a 1 litre container with it, let it set, and weigh the finished product to determine density. Hopefully the un-foamed 1 litre casting would weigh at least 2kg. Then I'd hit the casting with a hammer to see if I thought it strong enough.

    The phosphoric acid would also contribute a phosphate bonding mechanism to the set, you'd have to find out if it still works without it. Though the SDS says it has "cement alumina chemicals" in the range of 10-55% so it should set well anyway.

    Gunnables are mixed fairly runny, I think, so it might be a good candidate for a double sided mould that can be poured rather than just packing it over a sand mould.
    Last edited by wotavidone; 05-17-2018, 05:33 PM.

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  • wotavidone
    replied
    Chaps, I believe if this is Morgan Ceramics CEASE-FIRE VT 600, then it is a refractory expanding foam for high temperature insulation. Looks damned good for that use.

    Here is the SDS for C-F VT 2000, C-F VT600
    http://msvsc03-g735nw.uv.netbenefit....?id=3105&lang=

    Here is the data sheet for VT 2000
    http://www.matweb.com/search/datashe...9f76bc2&ckck=1

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  • david s
    replied
    Check it’s density., it should be heavy like a bag of cement if it’s the dense type. at $15/ 55 lb bag it’s very cheap. Also check it’s date of manufacture. Don’t use it if it’s gone lumpy. Also don’t mix more than half a bag at a time as the stuff goes off very quickly. 2” thick is the normal thickness and that gives you enough thermal mass for good cooking. Use a 2” thick floor of firebricks laid loose. The simplest way to go is to cast the dome in situ over a sand mould on top of the firebrick floor bricks. Don’t forget to insulate under them.
    Last edited by david s; 05-17-2018, 12:35 PM.

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  • TARibs
    replied
    Thanks for that info David, This is what they sent me

    "We do not sell fireclay, however we do have an overstock castable refractory product, called VT600 for $15 per 55lb bag.

    Mortar:
    Heat Stop 50, Outdoor Hydraulic Setting Refractory Mortar, 50 lb bag - $68 each
    3000°F Premixed Refractory Mortar, 55 lb pail - $68

    at $15 for a 55 lb bag it sounds like it might be ideal.

    How thick do you think I would need to make the dome if this product is what you say? And again based on what I read here it sounds like its better to do it in multiple pours (which would seem to be easier as well)

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  • david s
    replied
    There are heaps of castable refractory products out there. If it is CAC (Calcium Aluminate Cement) then it should be labelled as such. If it is called castable refractory it should be the bagged product containing CAC, high temperature aggregates and usually with burnout fibres added which assist in water elimination more safely. There are generally two types, an insulating castable which should only be used as insulation as it won't provide the thermal mass required and results in too weak a casting unable to withstand wear and abrasion. The other type is the dense castable more suited to hot face service which is also more suited for an oven the density is in the region of 2000 kg/m2 or 2 kg/litre. Castable refractory is superior to making your own castable from home-brew, but way more expensive. If making up your own castable you should add some burnout fibres like the very fine polypropylene ones (not the thicker/longer nylon ones) used in some concrete random fibre reinforcing.

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  • TARibs
    started a topic Castable Refractory Products (VT600)

    Castable Refractory Products (VT600)

    I am looking at casting a dome for my Oven. Checking sources for Fireclay I came across a place called Smart Ceramics in Woburn MA, (they apparently have changed their name to Rubix Composites) They told me the have a Castable refractory product called VT600. Has anyone ever heard of it. I'm not sure what it is exactly but suspect it is a castable cement product and from reading the Forums (Particularly david S ) I believe it would need to have crashed firebrick or some other suitable aggregate added to it. I've asked them if they have a spec sheet on it so I can get more information.

    Also while I'm here when someone mentions casting the dome do you recommend using the home mix to do that or is the home mix really for the using between bricks on the brick ovens?

    Thanks
    Tom
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