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42" Build in Seville Ohio!!

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  • #16
    Originally posted by UtahBeehiver View Post
    The inner dome height increased because the pivot point on the IT was not a floor level but off the floor level. It is not notice on the low levels but as you reach the top of the dome the offset is apparent. As far as the ratio, it is what it is now. Nothing you can do abt it now. For all you new builders out there, this is why we advocate having the ITpivot point as close to the floor level as possible. I don't believe this will adversely affect you oven
    Thanks Utah for the stern yet helpful response.....I don't believe that you are a big fan of my work but yet you are still willing to help, I appreciate that very much, thanks again! Zoo

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    • #17
      Thanks to this post, and me dry stacking a few bricks on number 4 I now know what this inverted V thing is that everyone is t all talking about. Looks like I am gonna be making some extra bevel cuts Haha

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Brwilliams88 View Post
        Thanks to this post, and me dry stacking a few bricks on number 4 I now know what this inverted V thing is that everyone is t all talking about. Looks like I am gonna be making some extra bevel cuts Haha
        Excellent! Glad that this build is helping others There are a LOT of talented people on this forum and most of them are quite helpful....feel free to reach out at any point if you have questions. Zoo

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        • #19
          Originally posted by UtahBeehiver View Post
          The inner dome height increased because the pivot point on the IT was not a floor level but off the floor level. It is not notice on the low levels but as you reach the top of the dome the offset is apparent. As far as the ratio, it is what it is now. Nothing you can do abt it now. For all you new builders out there, this is why we advocate having the ITpivot point as close to the floor level as possible. I don't believe this will adversely affect you oven
          Hey Utah, another note on your post that may help other builders out there who are trying to make a go of their pizza dreams. While it is true that my indispensable tool was sitting on top of a piece 3/4 ply, that doesn't account for the other 1 1/4" of growth....For the last few courses of brick I removed the IT and used an elevated sand mold to finish it out. The sand dome was taller than I meant it to be, hence the extra growth.

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          • #20
            It is not about being hard on your build rather that to help others who planning or at this point in their build.We see a lot of builds and out goal is to help builders over common construction and design issues.

            The ply adds the thickness to the dome but take a look at the IT where it bolts into your base bracket. This pivot point should be at brick floor level. By the pic it appears and 1 or may 1.5" off the ply. It is not a big deal if you have an adjustable IT but you need know you need to adjust the radius down as you move up or you end up extending the dome height by the offset, ie in your case 3/4" ply thickness and 1 to 1.5" pivot point above floor lever of brick.
            Russell
            Google Photo Album [https://photos.google.com/share/AF1Q...JneXVXc3hVNHd3/]

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            • #21
              For those of you following this build but have not chimed in I would like to encourage you to use the resources available in this forum but also trust your intuition and abilities to make your oven happen. I've spent a great deal of time researching the different resources available in this forum and it has been a SIGNIFICANT help. Some of the builders on this forum are obviously very talented and have spent an exorbitant amount of time (years in some cases) building their ovens and some are true works of art. In my opinion, some of the extra lengths and steps taken by some of the builds can be intimidating and may lead to the idea that you cannot do this yourself. This is not farther from the truth....these ovens are based off of centuries old technology that are honestly pretty forgiving of minor imperfections. In my case, I really wanted to enjoy pizza this summer so I got everything ready and went after it pretty hard. This resulted in being to build the entire dome in a day and half. That being said, things are not 100% perfect, but I will hopefully be eating pizza here pretty shortly and I'm pretty confident that the few mistakes that I have made will be just fine and my pizza dough will still rise and fall with the best of them. If it wasn't for the current monsoon season here in Ohio I'd be completely done with the build...I will be updating shortly once progress has been made, in the meantime live long and pizza my amigos!! Zoo

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              • #22
                Originally posted by UtahBeehiver View Post
                It is not about being hard on your build rather that to help others who planning or at this point in their build.We see a lot of builds and out goal is to help builders over common construction and design issues.

                The ply adds the thickness to the dome but take a look at the IT where it bolts into your base bracket. This pivot point should be at brick floor level. By the pic it appears and 1 or may 1.5" off the ply. It is not a big deal if you have an adjustable IT but you need know you need to adjust the radius down as you move up or you end up extending the dome height by the offset, ie in your case 3/4" ply thickness and 1 to 1.5" pivot point above floor lever of brick.
                No worries Utah, I hear what you are saying and I get that you are just trying to help and I do appreciate that. I was just trying to point out that it is possible to build a decent oven without taking months / years to do it. You and the other members offer great tips and advice out of the kindness of your heart and you guys are an awesome resource to have...Honestly, I would never have attempted this build before I stumbled onto this site and the resources within it.

                That being said, in my case my IT is adjustable and I did account for the mounting piece of the pivot point but not the plywood, my bad....the rest of the growth came from the sand mold. Zoo

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                • #23
                  Good luck with the rest of your build.
                  Russell
                  Google Photo Album [https://photos.google.com/share/AF1Q...JneXVXc3hVNHd3/]

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Gulf View Post
                    Having the joints full of mortar effects both structural and performance imo. Just how much, I really don't know for sure.

                    Mortar is more for holding bricks apart than it is for holding bricks together. The theory behind the Pompeii (spherical) dome is that it can't fall in on itself. As you said, "The bricks in the dome are obviously mortared in on the back side". But, I can't tell for sure what technique was used to do this. If the wide side of the trowel is used to push it in from the back side, the mortar will bridge over and not penetrate very far into the head joint, leaving gaps toward the interior. A better technique (if not buttering the head joint) would be to "chop" the mortar downward into the head joint with the edge of the trowel from the top as each brick is laid.

                    The dome, like the floor, is a heat bank for the oven. It provides both radiant heat and also works like a battery to store energy (heat) for retained heat cooking. The more gaps the less radiant and less retained heat.

                    Is any of this a critical error?; probably not. Is your oven going to fall in on itself within your lifetime?; probably not. Are you going to notice performance issues; probably not, unless you build an identical oven with all the joints full and compare the results. Like I said "probably not"

                    My response wasn't to critique or alarm you. It was to alert future followers of this build to (what one of my mentors) would have called a "best practice"
                    Ok....So.....I'm a total hypocrite and owe you and Utah an apology lol! You guys were right all along, pointing is absolute necessary and why would I go through all of that effort to not spend the couple of hours to make the oven build better in the short and long term...So, sorry for doubting your advice, my bad...That being said we FINALLY got a day with that big ball in the sky that we call the sun here in Ohio and I was able to make some progress on pointing and also fitted the blanket around the dome, see pics. Also, I know I have more work to do in the pointing department in terms of filling and cleaning but I'm getting there. Also, I will be doing an enclosure so i think that I'm gonna skip the Vcrete layer.... thoughts on that? Thanks again for all the advice! Zoo

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                    • #25
                      With the weather finally cooperating I've made some progress.... Thanks to UtahBeehiver and Gulf for showing me the way on the importance of pointing in the oven dome. I really wanted to think that it was unnecessary which is...well....just plain incorrect and a total rookie viewpoint. I've completed pointing in the dome and just need to wire wheel some of the excess mortar off, which I'll do tomorrow, and then I'll be onto my curing fires. I think I'm also gonna drill some weep holes in the slab before I put the lid on, it can't hurt. If anyone can think of anything else I'm missing before I'm passed the point of no return that'd be awesome! I'll keep you posted Zoo

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                      • #26
                        Dome looks better now pointing complete. I see you are using a halogen light, that will get you up to about 150F, next use charcoal briquettes for a couple fires (around 200 F) and you can cook some dutch oven while you are at it. Then small fires, this is were we see a lot of builders get a little impatient and go too fast and too hot cracking their work after all that hard labor. Take your time, the turtle wins the race on the cure. David S suggest placing a piece of plastic sheeting over the insulation and if you see condensation, then the oven is still wet, if you see steam, you are going to hot and fast.
                        Russell
                        Google Photo Album [https://photos.google.com/share/AF1Q...JneXVXc3hVNHd3/]

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                        • #27
                          Be careful with the grinding in that cofined space. Wear a suitable respirator and full goggles. Also forced air to clear the debris. The pointing needs at least a week to cure before starting any drying. If you haven't read about it, the Aussie heatbead (charcoal) drying works great for the initial heating. Use a charcoal chimney to start the charcoal outside of the oven. Use paper or a commercial lighting cube. (No charcoal lighting fluid) Spread the coals around. You can also cook while doing this.
                          Joe Watson " A year from now, you will wish that you had started today" My Build Album / My Build

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                          • #28
                            Just curious, what does the term "pointing" mean ?

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                            • #29
                              Basically, pointing is filling any gaps where mortar does not completely fill the spaces between brick. If you do a search on pointing brick you will find mostly information on repointing. Russell, UtahBeehiver , included a pic of a pointing tool in post #6. Pointing tools come in different sizes that correspond to the sizes of a the various sized mortar joints for normal normal brick work. The V-joints in a WFO that are caused by the compound curve are not normal. The V-joint can go from 0" to upwardss of 3/4". It takes a lot of ingenuity to completely fill a joint like that using any type of tool. It can be done but, (for those following the build) it is best to make sure that all head and bed joints are full while initially laying the brick. It is a lot easier once you learn how to butter the brick with mortar. It only takes practicie to figure this out. Always make sure that hte joints to the inside of the dome are completely full while first laying the brick. If there is a void, make sure that it is to the outside.It is so much easier to point from the outside of the dome.
                              Joe Watson " A year from now, you will wish that you had started today" My Build Album / My Build

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Brwilliams88 View Post
                                Just curious, what does the term "pointing" mean ?
                                Yea...what Gulf said...

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