Ciabatta bread video

[Dutchoven]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

The Primavera is generally available, and I am happy to say it is selling really well.
James

That's good! I will talk to them about it then!

I know you might have just missed the query but....how did you handle the transfer from the proofing board to the peel?
Best
Dutch

[james]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

Dutch,
I used a metal pizza peel to get my loaves from the board to the wood peel. It seemed like it would be the easiest way to accurately set the bread in the oven. Basically, I used pizza technique, where I held a tip of the bread and shot the peel under it. I lightly re-shaped it on the wood peel.

What do you think?
James

[Dutchoven]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

James,
I think you did a great job of it!
That is IMHO the most difficult part of handling the ciabatta. I kind of figured that was what you did, given your experience making pizza. I think it is a very good way of doing it. We often proof ours in a couche so we have to flip them onto a turning board and then slide them onto the peel(can be very stressful when the loaves are borderline overproofed(thanks to rain or otherwise). Every once in a while a few get a bit deflated but, the flavor doesn't change when they do that.
Oh, I meant to say also that the amount of char you had on these was not enough, at least for me, to consider them charred.
On oven steaming I would recommend you go to whatever garden center you like and get one of those pump sprayers(size doesn't really matter). Some have a copper wand(which would be really durable) but even the plastic is fine for spryaing in the oven. It will give you a continuous spray that will more effectively fill the oven with steam as you can put the tip way in the back and work your way out!
Best
Dutch

[dbhansen]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

On oven steaming I would recommend you go to whatever garden center you like and get one of those pump sprayers...

Dutch, I'm intrigued. Do you mean one of those ~3-gallon pressurized sprayers you might use for pesticides, etc? Sounds like a great solution.

[james]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

Hey Dutch and Jim,

How long do you run the garden spray in your oven? Also, could you guess at how long that would translate in a small oven like the Primavera?

Thanks for that.

Dutch, I can imagine that dealing with larger volumes of bread, weather and oven temperature can be stressful. Do you find that the couche really changes the character of the bread, when compared with final proofing on a board?
James

[Alfredo]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

Do you mean one of those ~3-gallon pressurized sprayers you might use for pesticides, etc? Sounds like a great solution.

That's what CanuckJim uses. Very no-tech, but it works a treat. I'm pretty sure he posted a picture in another topic a while ago, but it's just like this: ANTOnline.com - The Gilmour Group 030PEXG 3 Gal Operating Lawn & Garden Sprayer

[Dutchoven]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

That's the animal...works great!

Dutch, I'm intrigued. Do you mean one of those ~3-gallon pressurized sprayers you might use for pesticides, etc? Sounds like a great solution.

[Dutchoven]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

Hey Dutch and Jim,

How long do you run the garden spray in your oven? Also, could you guess at how long that would translate in a small oven like the Primavera?

Thanks for that.

Dutch, I can imagine that dealing with larger volumes of bread, weather and oven temperature can be stressful. Do you find that the couche really changes the character of the bread, when compared with final proofing on a board?
James

James and all
We usually steam it until it rolls out of the oven a minute or so before loading the oven...then the same amount just before closing the door...no specific time really...remember to vent the steam about halfway through the bake if you want a bit of a crisper crust.
There are a lot of things to juggle with WFO baking...I would not say that the couche alters the character of the bread but it can give you more options as far as the outward appearance. Slack doughs proofed on a board tend to spread out and not up but if you keep them in a couche they tend to get puffier...sometimes puffy enough that you can give them a few pokes with your fingers...a little more stressful on transferring because it is very easy to deflate them....but you can kind of stretch them out a bit when you load them and get some different looks...if you use a couche and stretch it a bit you can get what I think is called "stirato"...looks kind of like a pain l'ancienne baguette.
We followed the formula today using 2/3 bread flour and 1/3 APF and were pleased with the results from the gas oven in the kitchen. Still seems that our dough was a bit more slack than yours...made some really tasty bread though...had roasted pepper and provolone sandwiches for luch
Best
Dutch

[ERASMO]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

James

Do you have any video of pizza cooking in the Primavera 60?

[james]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

Hello Erasmo,

I've been planning on doing that in the next few days. Funnily enough, I baked a lot of pizza in the Primavera when we were building and testing the prototypes, but never did a video. Getting the oven temperature just right for a hearth loaf is one of the more challenging things you will do in your Primavera -- more difficult than pizza (I think) -- so I wanted to get that video done and show that side of the Primavera oven.

The kids are off school for two days for mid-term break, and I will do the pizza video after they are back in school.

Stay tuned...
James

[david s]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

I tried making a rack from steel mesh to fit over my bottom loaf so I could have a second loaf above it. Well it didn't work. I think the metal tray that the upper loaf was on just reflected the heat away from the lower loaf by shielding it. These wood ovens work by radiation of heat not like a standard convection oven. Also there is no fan to circulate the heat. I will only do single layers now. A metal baking tray avoids the burning bottom and also avoids problems sliding the loaf a la pizza style. I use a small pie dish 1/2 full of hot water, placed in the oven with the bread.

[charles54]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

Cooking is one of my specialties. While in the US Army Reserves I learned about Cooking. Indoor, outdoor and cooking using a utensil over an open flame was fun and easy with cast iron cookware. I remember the outdoors and the smell of cooking, accompanied by the chorus of the squirrels, crickets and birds, during bivouacs.

The most ordinary form of cooking is campfire cooking. For families it is particularly well fitting, it is an activity which presents an opportunity for pleasant evenings and outings. It has its own taste and fancy. Skill and knowledge is required, but both are easily acquired. Cooking is a tradition in itself and some cooks have years of experience both on safaris and at home. It is one of my favorite things in life. It is great; however, most open flame cooking is done in campgrounds. Credit to improvements in camping cooking gear and a horde of easy-prep and in-store ingredients, it need not be limited to burgers, dogs and smokes. Another unique way of cooking is to cook some food items inside of other foods. Another unusual cooking, using a utensil over an open flame method, is cooking in paper. An unfussy and simple way of outdoor cooking is to set a large coffee can on the coals. The days of utilitarian campfire cooking of yesteryear are gone. Try out a few odd techniques the next time you're out camping.

[SPB]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

Hi Folks,

The ciabatta made in the video looks exactly like the ciabatta that I get at one of my favourite restaurants, which is the ciabatta I'm trying to make; uneven crust colour with soft, shiny, open, random holed crumb.

However, that ciabatta looks different to Hamelman's Ciabatta.
I have Hamelman's excellent book and I made his Poolish Ciabatta and it turned out very much like that shown in the photo within his book.
Hamelman's has a more even crust colour and a denser, more even crumb than the OP's.
Tasty still, but not where I'm trying to get to.


This is the ciabatta I'm trying to make:
Looks like the one in the video, huh?




This is my attempt at Hamelman's, sans Hamelman's folding and shaping finesse:





What is the difference?

Is it the flour?
I use a high (12%) protein flour but I see the OP used a standard flour.

Is it hard vs soft water?

Is it the OP's recipe tweak of slightly more hydration?

I'm perplexed whilst salivating at the thought of baking bread like that shown in the video.

Please help.

[SPB]

Re: Ciabatta bread video - how to achieve?

I hate when you spent half an hour typing up a post and it vanishes at the push of a button....

Anyway, here's a condensed version now:

I'm trying to get from here:
(my attempt at Hamelman's poolish ciabatta, sans Hamelman's folding and shaping finesse)




...to here:
(looks just like James' ciabatta in the video, doesn't it)



Note, the soft, shiny, large random holed crumb and the uneven coloured crust vs Hamelman's even coloured crust and denser, more even holed crumb.

What's the difference?

Is it the flour? My high (12%) protein vs all purpose used by James?

Could it be hard vs soft water?

Could it be James' extra 2% hydration tweak to Hamelman's recipe?

Is it my lack of folding and shaping finesse?

I'm perplxed whilst salivating over the thought of baking ciabatta bread like James.

[SilentTemple]

Re: Ciabatta bread video

Thanks for all the tips, James, in your video. They're burned into my cranial dome.