winter cooking ?

[waynebergman]

Re: winter cooking ?

Hi Acoma. No all is well so far only 2 cooking fires though. Curing went good. The mortar I am using is made for large gaps and the very top of dome is a castable with reinforcing stainless needles. Should be ok but I will report any problems. Thanks for your interest. A bit cold here so might not do too much cooking for the next while, still working on facing outer dome with river rock...wayne

[Acoma]

Re: winter cooking ?

Wayne, I looked over a couple of your photos and noticed large gaps, lots of mortar for the last 4-6 courses. Do you feel that structurally all is still sound? Any issues with cracks, etc?
Thanks.

[CanuckJim]

Re: winter cooking ?

Guerito,

I'm not sure why they aren't listing Matrilite 18, but I've copied the material I posted directly from the bags and spec sheet. It may be that they've changed their designation since last fall, don't know. Matrilite 18 is commonly used as a secondary, or backup, castable insulator that is not meant for direct flame exposure as I understand it, though the spec sheet says it's good to 815 C (1500 F) in direct exposure or 982 C (1800 F) as a backup. Normally, it's used to fill kiln or furnace doors or sprayed on the outside of kilns, etc. The grain size is 2 mm (10 mesh and finer). Might be worth it to call them to find out. This is light material in the bag and is shipped in 25 lb. bags. I find three bags should about do it, four if you want to go thick. I pay $31.09 CDN, including the dreaded taxes, per bag. Likely, you'll be able to get it cheaper.

Good thing about it is that you don't have to mix anything, just add water (95to 100 per cent hydration), get everything uniformly wet and go.

Jim

[Guerito]

Re: winter cooking ?

Acoma, and Jim,

I?m just in the planning or design stage. I am gathering the best ideas and working them into my plan. I?ll probably start construction around the end of March or first of April. I?m looking at an igloo style with 2 to 3? of the new FB blanket, a little chicken wire, and then 2 to 3? of vermic/cement or Matrilite 18 over that. It sounds like the Matrilite product is better and a bit easier to work. Then I?d finish over the Matrilite 18 with a little waterproof stucco application.

Jim, Acoma had mentioned that he was going to use the Matrilite 18 as the final insulation layer and I thought he might have purchased has supply already. From following Acoma?s posts, I know that he likes to plan things our well in advance. Me too! We can sure call B-ville, TX for a local source. However, I did not see Matrilite 18 listed on their web site, just references to Matrilite 24 and 28. They might be a more expensive products that will go to 2400 of 2800 degrees, I don?t know???

Guerito

[Acoma]

Re: winter cooking ?

Jim, I am not confused. Once I need to get it I will. Please see that I was providing information for a U.S. contact for Guerito.

[CanuckJim]

Re: winter cooking ?

Acoma, Guerito,

I'm at a bit of a loss. Here, in Ontario, it's prety easy to obtain Matrilite 18 through a company that deals in refractory materials for furnace and kiln builders. Seem strange that you guys can't. Maybe a call to the main manufactuer might work? Don't know what else to say. Maybe email me about it.

Jim

[Acoma]

Re: winter cooking ?

Guerito, where are you in your process right now? I like that you are carefully thinking the steps as you (plan? move along?) prepare.

The US distributor is Allied Mineral Products, 3025 Mineral Loop, Brownsville, Texas, 1-614-878-0244

[Acoma]

Re: winter cooking ?

RC, forget the stucco material. Stay the course of insulating based on what Jim and I have said. Based on the scenery, desired look, you will want strong insulation as a factor. to worry about curring and quick fix in my opinion is wrong. Focus on finishing, curing, then pick up large tarps and painter blanket as necessary; or, rent a concrete blanket. Point to this is that it allows you to apply extra layers of the insulating elements, and to continue with the desired look. Don't rush.

[Guerito]

Re: winter cooking ?

Acoma,

Do you have your Matrilite 18 yet? Where did you find it? I have not had any luck.

I?m thinking of an igloo style, so a good insulating layer over the blanket is important. I?m thinking of using Matrilite 18 over the blanket rather than vermic/cement also. I have not had much luck with Jim?s link. I looked around the site, but I could only find a reference to Matrilite 24 and 28, and I didn?t see a distributor west of Texas.

Guerito

[RCLake]

Re: winter cooking ?

RC,
I used two rolls of 1 inch thick, (50 sq. ft each) over mine. I got at least two inches thickness around the sides, mostly 3 inches, and up to 5 inches on the top of the dome.

They say you can't over insulate. What kind of finish are you planning for your oven??? Mine's a bit mishapen because of the variances of thicknesses of blanket on it. Sounds like you have more than enough blanket to suit your needs.

George

Well my thoughts are very fluid right now. It will be stone structue at the end like this photo, but just as this has taken time, I'm wondering about a temporary sollution. After the dome is done(hopefully soon!) I'll do the curing, put on the ceramic blanket and I'm wondering if I'll stucco over it to weather protect it? One reason I may not do this I won't be able to add insulation later.

[gjbingham]

Re: winter cooking ?

Oh yeah,
I'd forgotten, you did. After looking around that site, I found matri-everything except matrilite. Maybe I didn't pursue it hard enough. Good resource for others though.

George

[CanuckJim]

Re: winter cooking ?

George,

I thought I posted this link at one time or other, but maybe not. Look at: Manufacturer of refractories and supplier of refractory services for the aluminum industry - Matrix Refractories . Matrix is the Refractories Division of Allied Mineral Products. This is a global company, and the North American headquarters is in Texas. They do have a list of products and distributors.

Jim

[gjbingham]

Re: winter cooking ?

Thanks Jim,
I did a number of searches for the matrilite 18 on Google, Yahoo etc. I couldn't find much at all, and certainly no distributors.

I went with vermiculite/concrete over chicken wire (and blankets), then stucco. I'm pretty close to symetrical, but certainly not perfect. You can't really tell unless you walk around it and specifically look for asymetry.

George

[CanuckJim]

Re: winter cooking ?

George,

Those wishing to have a symetrical igloo shape for the finished oven might try this approach: apply the blankets, then chicken wire, then a thickish layer of either vermic/Portland or Matrilite 18. I use Matrilite 18 because it's a better insulator at about the same price. Either material can be a bit tricky when trowelling onto near vertical surfaces, but have a spray bottle handy to dampen the blanket as necessary. Once you get the hang of it, it's not difficult to even out bumpy or low spots in the blanket layer. Even if some remain, you can fill them in the next day, once the material is set but not completely dry (alternately, you can dampen it, then apply additional). After that, you can use a stucco prep coat like Durex Monobase and finish with an exterior stucco. Treated this way, the igloo will not only have superior insulation, but it will be very weatherproof, maybe almost bulletproof. I'll post a pic in the gallery shortly.

Jim

[gjbingham]

Re: winter cooking ?

RC,
I used two rolls of 1 inch thick, (50 sq. ft each) over mine. I got at least two inches thickness around the sides, mostly 3 inches, and up to 5 inches on the top of the dome.

They say you can't over insulate. What kind of finish are you planning for your oven??? Mine's a bit mishapen because of the variances of thicknesses of blanket on it. Sounds like you have more than enough blanket to suit your needs.

George