I could sure use some help.

[conleff]

I've made up three batches of Tipo 00 pizza dough and all three have failed.
The first was do to a bad batch of yeast and the second two the finished product
was far to sticky and stringy to work with. Can anyone give me some advise as to what I'm doing wrong. Thanks

[gdest]

Re: I could sure use some help.

The best advise is to keep trying. The 2nd batch could have been saved just by adding a little more flour and kneeding it in. The more you make dough the more comfortable you become with the feel and process

Gary

[conleff]

Re: I could sure use some help.

Thanks Gary. Since my original post I have tried a few more times and I'm
starting to get a feel for it but I haven't reached a point I'm satisfied with.
I was highly encouraged when I successfully made dough with other flours
I got from King Arthur. Thanks for taking the time to help a beginner. I'm a self taught cook who has a fairly good feel for cooking but flour and water have always been a mystery to me. But I'm a thick headed German extraction and I'm determined to get the proper feel and advice like yours is greatly appreciated.

[Greenman]

Re: I could sure use some help.

For what it is worth I started with the standard recipe from the sticky thread on this site. I used the scales to get the quantities right and had success of sorts first up. Second time around I divided it after the first rise and put the containers in the fridge for a day, much better result. The third attempt I think I started to 'get it' regarding the 'feel' of the dough.

I too had the notion that there was a deal of mystique and a little witchcraft involved when flour and yeast met. Reading some of the technical conversations by those who are passionate about bread and dough generally went close to doing my head in, and as right and relevant that is, I reckon that the newbie dough wrangler is best advised to stick to the basics until they get that sorted.

Since human nature is never happy with what they have done my next batch I will try replacing a small portion of the flour with some stoneground wholemeal organic flour that I use for some other things. What I have discovered already is that it is better than 00 for getting pizza to come off the peel first up.

Good luck with your dough wrangling. IMHO proper quantities, attention to the very simple details of the basic recipe and some determination will produce a good result (eventually). Just have to go steady with the wing of bat and eye of newt.

[Tscarborough]

Re: I could sure use some help.

Is the problem the dough or getting the dough into the oven? If it is the dough, try reducing the hydration, although posting your exact mix would help. If the problem is getting the dough off the peel, use more flour when forming it and buy a slotted metal peel to launch them into the oven.

[conleff]

Re: I could sure use some help.

Thanks guys for the advice and help. I tried following the Forno Bravo recipe
found on the web site. 500g of their Tipo 00 flour, 325g of water, 10g of salt and 3g of active dry yeast. The first batch, the yeast was bad. The second and third batches were just too hydrated. The surface tension was not good
and the dough was simply too moist. I know I have to decrease the amount of water or increase the amount of flour but I've not played with this recipe long enough to estimate how much. I completely understand that patience and experimentation is a must but at the same time I'm certainly open to any suggestions or guesses.

[deejayoh]

Re: I could sure use some help.

You need to give more info about your process. How are you kneading, or are you S&F the dough? How are you proofing? When do you take out of the fridge?

There are a ton of variables to manage.

My $0.02 - Tipo 00 flour is expensive. Use standard flour while you are figuring things out. I would try Peter Reinhart's "Neo-Neopolitan" dough recipe from the site here - with no olive oil and standard bread flour. It's a 66% hydration recipe, gives a very workable dough if you give it enough time to develop and proof it sufficiently.

[conleff]

Re: I could sure use some help.

As for my kneading, I'm using a Kitchen Aid Pro mixer, I knead on stir for 2 minutes and then I autolyse for 20 minutes and then on #2 speed for 5 minutes and then back to stir for an additional 2 minutes. I then knead for a a few seconds and form dough balls and I let it rise for a couple of hours. I then put it in the fridge for overnight. I then take it out and let it sit at room temp for an hour or so. Its when I try to make the actual pizza I run into trouble.
I have been successfully making eatable pizzas using dough I purchased from King Arthur Flour, but I'm willing to spend the money to discover the proper way to make Tipo 00 dough.

[deejayoh]

Re: I could sure use some help.

I find that running into trouble when I make the pizzas is often due to the way I have done the proofing. Couple of things you might try:

1) Bulk proofing the dough - don't divide it until its proofed
2) Proof in the fridge - as soon as you're done kneading let it proof at least 6 hours, up to a couple days. A couple of hours at room temp, maybe it is getting over-proofed

When you are ready to use it, pull it out, divide into balls, and let proof at room temp for 2 hours. It should be quite workable at that point.

I don't have/use a mixer so can't comment on that part - Stretch and fold is so easy I haven't seen the need to buy one.

[conleff]

Re: I could sure use some help.

Thanks for the advice, I'll be trying again next weekend and I'll try your advice for sure. Thanks!