First go at sourdough

[Salv B]

Re: First go at sourdough

Jay - re the wholewheat - the bread must bake differently down here in the southern hemisphere I did have a closer look at the packaging the flour is in and it is labelled 85 percent light wholewheat - can the removal of 15 percent of the bran have that much of an effect on the colour? I might try and use wholewheat without anything removed next time and see how it goes.

I also took my last wholewheat loaf out of the freezer the other day. Here is a pic of what the inside looked like



This is compared to the sourdough loaf I made with only 10 percent wholewheat - quite a difference.

[egalecki]

Re: First go at sourdough

It's possible that you have a different style of wheat. Here in the US we can get both white and regular whole wheat. They're different kinds of wheat, and the color both in the baked good and in the bag are quite different.

Taking some of the bran out of the flour will help your gluten too, since it's the bran which cuts the strands. I can't buy flour like that here- I have to buy the coarse grind and sift it myself! So not worth it for me....

[Dutchoven]

Re: First go at sourdough

Taking some of the bran out of the flour will help your gluten too, since it's the bran which cuts the strands. I can't buy flour like that here- I have to buy the coarse grind and sift it myself! So not worth it for me....

Definitely does...good advice! I know how you feel Elizabeth...it is a drag...we don't do it with our wheat flour but we do it with our rye flour...it makes all the difference in our NY Rye
All the best!
Dutch

[Salv B]

Re: First go at sourdough

From what you are saying Elizabeth it is a good thing that 15 percent of the bran is removed. I'm fairly certain that the wolewheat is regular. I asked the supplier about this and they told me that the 85 percent light is made by sifting bran from the full wholewhweat, which has nothing removed. The Flour is organic and stoneground so I dont know if that makes any difference. I really like the taste of the wholewheat loaf - over the last few days I have been having it for breakfast toasted with some butter - so chewy and filling.

[texassourdough]

Re: First go at sourdough

Hi Salv!

Your photos of the bread serve as a good illustration of what Elizabeth referred to as bran damaging/weakening the gluten (though there are other factors that could be operative. I personally prefer the 10% look/loaf/structure but....preferences are always personal.

In any event you are making lovely wonderful bread.

Your description certainly seems to suggest that your flour is quite different from what we get.

My work in developing bread for a pizzaria is pushing me to bake in ways I normally would not. Hotter/longer oven times, higher internal temp, softer flour. It will be interesting to see if it leads me to shift my habits with my normal sourdough!

Keep Baking!
Jay

[egalecki]

Re: First go at sourdough

I've been trying out different whole wheat flours as I find them- I have tried what's probably a hard red wheat, in both fine and coarse grind, as well as a fine ground white wheat. I get better rise from the finely ground wheats, and while the taste of the coarse one is great, it tends to make a more "doorstop" style of bread all by itself.

I like mixing white and whole wheat flours as well. I get good results with a 50-50 split, and pushing it to 60-40 works pretty well too.

The flour you get with part of the bran removed, if it works well for you, is just fine. I think it's like what Peter Reinhart refers to as "high extraction" flour. I had to make mine, you are lucky enough to have it available!

In the end, go with what gives you the results you like. If you don't like a lot of flour on top, brush some off. If you want a lighter loaf (although yours looked pretty good), play with different flours.

Theres a book I'd recommend if you want to stick with whole wheat, "whole grain bread" by Peter Reinhart. He's got lots of recipes, and he has also got some transitional recipes (not 100% whole wheat) as bridges to making and eating the whole wheat. I have his transitional multigrain with seeds going right now....

[Salv B]

Re: First go at sourdough

Elizabeth - The Whole Grain Bread book is definitely on the top of my gift wish list. They are just so expensive here in Australia ($60 plus).
I would love to see pics of how your transitional mutligrain with seeds comes out. I haven't used seeds yet but it is something I want to try next.

[texassourdough]

Re: First go at sourdough

Hi Salv!

Peter's Whole Grain Bread book is rather interesting in that he uses every trick imaginable to get as much flavor as possible out of the dough - while using commercial yeast to make it quick and easy. I am applying some of his techniques in working with a restaurant on making Pane Pugliese in a short 2nd morning time window. It is really, I think, an inspirational book and some of the bread, such as his Volkornbrot is amazing. Lots of seeds, lots of preferments and soakers, and.... Interesting book!

Good Luck!
Jay

[egalecki]

Re: First go at sourdough

I didn't get pictures of that loaf, but I can tell you it went quickly! Dense with the seeds, great flavor. It had sesame seeds, pumpkin seeds, and sunflower seeds in addition to cornmeal, oat bran and whole wheat and bread flours.

Next time I'll take a picture!

[Salv B]

Re: First go at sourdough

Some good luck - I managed to get the Reinhart book from the local Library so I have a month to have a read and and a try see how I like it. I like bread with seeds - Elizabeth - your loaf sounds yummy - was the formula from the Reinhart book?

[egalecki]

Re: First go at sourdough

yes, it's the transitional multigrain hearth loaf, I think. Very good.

Great job finding it at the library! That's a great way to decide if you want it- it is a pretty spendy book.

[texassourdough]

Re: First go at sourdough

The breads I like best in that book are the volkornbrot and the spent grain bread. The latter is a GREAT idea. Forces you to create a relationship with a microbrewery (and how can that be bad!) in order to get the spent grain. I have never yet had a micrbrewer decline swapping some spent grain for a loaf of bread (if the grain was available).

Good Luck Salv!
Jay

[texassourdough]

Re: First go at sourdough

Hi Salv!

Here is a photo of two loaves I did today with two different slashings - the one on the right is my "proprietary" "leaf" slash that sort of looks like a tree (because my last name is Forrest). They are both very slightly overdone by my taste but really close. The loaf on the left is IMO slightly underproofed (more vigorous rip) and the one on the left is slightly overproofed (I have to do them back to back when I use cloches for I make 4 loaves and only have capacity for two...)

The only thing I am critical of is that the crust is just a touch darker than I want. (NOTE: My baking for a restaurant led me to try a lower temp and longer time and I will go back to a higher temp and shorter time - I want the flaps to be dark - even darker than these - but the crust to be lighter so...)

These are straight double expansion sourdough with about 7% whole wheat, rest is bread flour. And they have a great crust!

I have been meaning to send you some photos and finally got to it!

Be Well!
Jay

[Salv B]

Re: First go at sourdough

Hi Jay,

Thanks for the pics. The loaves look great - I like the proprietary slash design - very creative! I see what you mean about liking the bread nice and dark - and with only 7% wholewheat.

[texassourdough]

Re: First go at sourdough

Hi Salv!

Two more pictures. The second is a photo of a Reinhart's Spent Grain bread and the other is a close up of the rip on a loaf that shows the color variation I like. Medium crust (just a tad dark in this picture) the rip showing lighter colors, and the flap on the slits showing the darkest color.

Enjoy!
Jay