First Pizza & Cracks!

[Lburou]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Thanks for the help guys

I don't see mucking around to expose the exterior cracks and putting a slurry in them is much of a risk to the oven. There are some tight places in there though and the risk to me may be a bit larger .


The bond problem issue is at the heart of these cracks: Lesson learned.
I wish the plans recommended only sailor courses, period.

I found some Dap ASTM E-136 rated High heat mortar in a tube. Tube says its good to 2000 F & cures in one hour, less if it gets warm.....Will that serve as your slurry Brickie? I see myself leaning over the enclosure -oven at medium heat- with a caulking gun and putty knife

Thanks again

The Dap ASTM E-136 rated High heat mortar in a tube -From HD or Lowe's- was easy to use and, for at least one firing, plugged the cracks and stabilized the loose bricks with ease. I removed a lot of loose mortar, cleaned the areas between bricks with an ice pick and started a fire in the oven. After 30 minutes of fire in the oven, I caulked the cracks with the mortar and smoothed the outside with a putty knife. Max dome temp I measured was 950 F, then, I fed a smaller fire for three hours to cure the mortar.
This morning, the cracks are filled, bricks stable....All seems OK.
I would use this product again.

[brickie in oz]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Will that serve as your slurry Brickie? I see myself leaning over the enclosure -oven at medium heat- with a caulking gun and putty knife

Probably, but I dont know the product.

[lwood]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Congrats Lee, job well done and happy baking. Those cracks don't look that serious. Do you see smoke coming out of them when you are firing the oven. I see the soot in the crack but it doesn't look like it lets much gas escape. I would try to patch it to stop any hot gases from escaping. Doing it while it's warm seems like the right thing to do, so you might want to get some help.

You now have a lot of fun ahead learning your stove and dough. Good luck Lee.

[Lburou]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

It won't hurt to try to patch it but it won't make much difference. Many/most? ovens develop cracks through the interior dome to the insulation. Not desirable but... Based on photos some of the cracks are pretty large but the ovens still work okay. Not as big a deal for pizza IMO as bread but...not really a big deal either way.

Hang in there!
Jay

If that were mine Id heat it up again and mix a slurry of water and cement and while still hot and expanded paint the slurry into the cracks.
As it cools it should stay expanded like it wants to but with a seal in place to stop any smoke.

Is it cracked on the inside too.

Thanks for the help guys

I don't see mucking around to expose the exterior cracks and putting a slurry in them is much of a risk to the oven. There are some tight places in there though and the risk to me may be a bit larger .

The oven works well in terms of my expectations. I don't think I cured too fast. I suspect the settling of the underfloor insulation may have a substantive part in these cracks. Yes Brickie, there are cracks on the inside but they didn't look that bad to me. With tapered bricks I doubt the bricks are going very far.

The bond problem is at the heart of these cracks too: Lesson learned. I wish the plans recommended only sailor courses, period.

I found some Dap ASTM E-136 rated High heat mortar in a tube. Tube says its good to 2000 F & cures in one hour, less if it gets warm.....Will that serve as your slurry Brickie? I see myself leaning over the enclosure -oven at medium heat- with a caulking gun and putty knife

Thanks again

[brickie in oz]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

If that were mine Id heat it up again and mix a slurry of water and cement and while still hot and expanded paint the slurry into the cracks.
As it cools it should stay expanded like it wants to but with a seal in place to stop any smoke.

Is it cracked on the inside too.

[texassourdough]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

It won't hurt to try to patch it but it won't make much difference. Many/most? ovens develop cracks through the interior dome to the insulation. Not desirable but... Based on photos some of the cracks are pretty large but the ovens still work okay. Not as big a deal for pizza IMO as bread but...not really a big deal either way.

Hang in there!
Jay

[Lburou]

Now that the celebration is over, some serious CRACK questions

I'm happy with the performance of my oven. When I was a pilot, it was important to do a post flight inspection of the aircraft. Well, I have kept that habit in many aspects of my life and it spilled over into operation of this pleasuredome and found some (to me) serious evidence of smoke on the outside of the dome. :gulp:

I put a 5/8 to 3/4 inch layer of castable refractory material over my dome. It has cracks in it. I would not even mention it except there is black soot on the margins of some of the crack after the first time taking it to pizza temperatures. These are the pictures:
, ,

Should I attempt to patch this air leak, or just put the ceramic insulation and vermiculite right over it?

The plan is to build a cover over the oven, with the enclosure meeting the ceiling created by the cover. This cover will communicate with the roof of my house.

Option one: I'm contemplating insulation as above, with a cap of vermicrete to contain any escaping gases.

Option two: chip the castable layer along the crack away and repair the mortar joints underneath, then insulate.

What do you think?

Thanks in advance

[david s]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Congratulations Lee. Now you can concentrate on the cooking. On floor cleaning I prefer coals to burn away anything left on the floor and the blow pipe technique to clear it of ash. You'll have fun experimenting with all these ideas and establish your own style and regime.

[brickie in oz]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Good to see the oven working.....yahhhh......

I usually put the pizzas in on the trays and take them off when firm enough to brown the bases.

That tampitco (sp) brush I bought a while ago sweeps the floor really clean too btw.

[texassourdough]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Yes, Lee!

You are correct. Anything you put under the pie will "slow" or "even" (depending on what it is) the cooking of the bottom of the pizza. A pan probably reduces the effective hearth temp by 25 to 50 degrees. Even parchment has a significant impact. (Try baking two loaves of bread in your indoor oven on a hot stone - one on parchment, one bare. The bare loaf will have a darker bottom crust.)

As you comment in the previous email, the wire brush does a good job!

Bake on!
Jay

[Lburou]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Hi Lee!

Glad to hear you finally have your oven on line. Congrats!

The dough in your pie pic looks good. The color suggests the proofing was about right. Looks like your hearth was a bit hot for your dome (the bottom/edge looks dark relative to the caramalization of the toppings) (a bigger flame will solve that).

Mopping pizza ovens is not IMO a proper practice. It cools your hearth excessively and you will not gracefully recharge it unless you put coals on it...and then if you mop it it will be too cool again.... Mopping is a means for humidifying a bread oven and to some extent adjusting the hearth/oven temp. And mopping is done only with a damp rag/mop. You don't want it dripping water. Just damp enough to collect the soot. For pizza use a brass brush.

Good to have you finished!
Jay

Thanks for the infomation Jay, I always try to understand what you write, but it is sometimes over my head and out of my depth. I'm working on it

Is my assumption correct then, that the pizza pan slowed cooking of the bottom of the pizza? Maybe someone should start a thread showing the 'perfect looking pizza'.

I have so much to learn.

[Lburou]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Hey Lee!

Thanks for the report and congrats! Must have felt good to finally knock the first pie out. With 44 years behind you both, you owed your honey the first one even if it was in a pan. For my wife, I'd have had to use a wash cloth on a stick. Good luck with the insulation.

John

I was actually surprised how clean the FB wire brush got the floor.
I would have gone ahead to cook on the bricks except the bricks were not even. My insulation is so soft I can use a rubber hammer to level the floor. Its just that the dome keeps settling into the insulation The settling is bound to stop sometime!

And Yes John, it was good to get those first few pizzas out and on to the feeding table!

Now, the next phase of my education begins: Pizza dough and bread making.

[texassourdough]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Hi Lee!

Glad to hear you finally have your oven on line. Congrats!

The dough in your pie pic looks good. The color suggests the proofing was about right. Looks like your hearth was a bit hot for your dome (the bottom/edge looks dark relative to the caramalization of the toppings) (a bigger flame will solve that).

Mopping pizza ovens is not IMO a proper practice. It cools your hearth excessively and you will not gracefully recharge it unless you put coals on it...and then if you mop it it will be too cool again.... Mopping is a means for humidifying a bread oven and to some extent adjusting the hearth/oven temp. And mopping is done only with a damp rag/mop. You don't want it dripping water. Just damp enough to collect the soot. For pizza use a brass brush.

Good to have you finished!
Jay

[GianniFocaccia]

Re: First Pizza & Cracks!

Hey Lee!

Thanks for the report and congrats! Must have felt good to finally knock the first pie out. With 44 years behind you both, you owed your honey the first one even if it was in a pan. For my wife, I'd have had to use a wash cloth on a stick. Good luck with the insulation.

John

[Lburou]

First Pizza!



A mason helped me with the heavy lifting during this build. He laid 70% of the blocks and bricks and mixed all the cement in his mixer. Wanted him to be in on the first cooking escapade. His parents were visiting from Mexico, so they were all over to paddle and float on the river yesterday.



I built a smallish fire and let it heat over two hours time. The dome began to clear a small circle at the top around 750 F and finished clearing about 850-900 F. The peak oven temp was 950 F -with peak floor temp about 875 F.

Was good to see the bricks in the dome again, except for those cracks I realize now that those cracks don't affect the cooking and it seems the oven won't fall down First pizza was less than two minutes (floor temp was over 800 F).

I was most worried about the operation of the oven today and bought some of the pizza dough and used a pizza pan to cook the pizza with because I had given the mop away and couldn't wet mop the floor :humble:

My good wife of 44 years had an observation about the doneness of her crust (I was sure to make the first pizza out of the oven her pizza). She noted that the bottom of the crust was not done as much as the top of the pizza, I explained that cooking next time without a pizza pan would do the trick.

All-in-all, it was a successful day. Will insulate the oven soon and begin the facade. Also, during the oven construction, the four inches of (supposed) rigid insulation has settled one eighth inch under the dome, leaving the floor bricks in the center of the oven a bit uneven. I will have to work on that soon to have unobstructed peel right of way.

A lot to learn about this oven and how to make things flow next time (s).

P.S. For you dough gurus out there, there was some sugar in the dough I got from a pizza parlor, that made the crust pretty brown, my dough (Tscarborogh's beer recipe) was more a crispy, golden brown.