36" in Seattle

[kebwi]

Re: 36" in Seattle

Thanks, but I would rather learn how to use proper pizza flour first. Once I get basic pizza figured out I might try experimenting with other things. As for the my routine, it's basically the instructions in the FB pizza ebook. I'm a little shady on the details because my wife made yesterday's dough (I was outside doing construction on the oven). I'm sure she's following the recipe.

I handled the dough after she mixed it, so I know what happened from that point forward. I dumped it out, it was very light and sticky, which I took as a good sign. I folded it in thirds, rotated it, folded it in thirds again, plunked it in a bowl for two hours, seam down. Then I took that out and quartered it (a whole recipe according to FB), folded each chunk and rolled it into a ball, put in tupperware for another hour, seam down. Then made pizza.

[david s]

Re: 36" in Seattle

The semolina addition will add crunch to your pizza base when used with any flour. We always use it add about 7%

[Raffy]

Re: 36" in Seattle

Hey Keith,

Do you have the temperature reading for the cooking floor as you're cooking? How long does it take for the pizzas to cook? Can you provide pics of the pizza crust cross-section and underneath? I think I know the reason of your tough crust but I need the info for the above questions to confirm.

Raffy

[kebwi]

Re: 36" in Seattle

What's the reason Raffy? Even if your aren't sure, share the wisdom. I think the floor was around 600. I don't know how to make it hotter than that since the oven was fully blast and fully cleared with a 900 dome. I didn't precisely time the pizzas this latest attempt. Not two long, maaaybe longer than the prescribed 90s, but I'm not sure.

[Tscarborough]

Re: 36" in Seattle

I get about the same, but the floor goes up to about 700. I want to build a low rack to keep the fire (and the insulating ashes)off the floor. I also plan on putting the door on for about 10-15 minutes next time to try and get some equalization after I de-ash it.

[kebwi]

Re: 36" in Seattle

But that would kill the fire. You are specifically supposed to keep the fire going during pizza. I agree with your hunch though, I'm wondering if the ash and coals are actually insulating the floor. Perhaps what I need to do is push the fire to one side, get it roaring on one side, then wait a few minutes to cook pizza. Maybe then the heat would beat down on the floor and bring it up to temp.

I need to read the relevant FB books on this again. I'm confused by my floor temp.

[Tscarborough]

Re: 36" in Seattle

Well, the way I do it is remove most of the coals and ash, then put just some coals and more wood in. I will just wait until I take the door off to put them back in.

[sjmeff]

Re: 36" in Seattle

Keith - is the fire you have going licking the side of the dome? In my experience, the fire needs to be big enough to curl up the inside of your dome almost reaching the keystone (and the logs should touch the dome to encourage drawing the flame up the dome wall). In my oven, that's critical for keeping the floor temps in the 750-800+ range. As soon as I move the ashes over to one side, I immediately throw on some logs and keep some burning while I'm cooking pizza.

Like Tscarborough, I also sometimes remove a shovel or two of ashes if my initial fire was really big. I think too many ashes keeps the oven from getting really hot.

[olddude]

Re: 36" in Seattle

So what your saying is to much (a*s) keeps it from getting hot?

or just moving the a*s makes it hotter lol

this would answer a real big question around here
to much a*s could be her fault
need to move ones a*s would be my fault

[Raffy]

Re: 36" in Seattle

Hi Keith,

Based on the pics you provided, I can only deduce that your cooking floor temp is too low. I cook my pizzas at around 400 - 425 degrees celsius resulting in a thin crunchy layer outside and a nice "bready" (for want of a better term) layer inside. If the bottom side takes too long to cook, it will result in a tough and chewy crust. If you say that you cook in the 600 F, roughly 315 C, I definitely think temperature is the culprit.

How soon after the firing do you start cooking? The dome gets hot pretty quick but its a matter of getting the cooking floor to "catch up" with the dome's temp. For a commercial oven (running 24/7), we had to wait one hour after firing til we could start cooking in the morning. Even when we could feel the blazing heat from the opening, we knew that the floor still wasn't hot enough til the prescribed waiting time was over.

About the ash, even a thin barrier of ash will affect the transmission of heat to the crust. In the pizzeria where I used to work, if we got the cooking floor too hot, we would scatter/throw rock salt onto the floor to keep the crust from burning. It was an effective method that we used when too much fuel was added to the fire.

Lastly, I recommend you wait a while after you have wiped the cooking floor with a wet rag. It may only be seconds but thats enough to reduce the cooking floor temp.

Sorry for the long answer. Hope this solves your problem.

Raffy

[papavino]

Re: 36" in Seattle

How often do you clean out the ash from your oven? It looks like there is an awful lot in there. And are you able to easily turn the pizza in the back of the oven? I only cook one at a time in my 36". And I let the dome go completely white before cooking for best results to tag on to what Raffy was saying about waiting to get the floor temp up. I usually just brush the floor well, then toss the pizzas on without mopping.

[kebwi]

Re: 36" in Seattle

Hey papavino, haven't heard from you in a while.

How often do you clean out the ash from your oven? It looks like there is an awful lot in there.

I have yet to clean my oven out at all. I haven't bought or constructed an ash pan or box yet. The total amount of ash isn't going up though. Each fire cooks down to about the same amount of final ash and coal, which goes to the side while cooking, then gets mixed into the next fire.

I was under the impression there was no call to clean the ash and coals out for pizza, only for bread, a topic I discuss later in this post...

And are you able to easily turn the pizza in the back of the oven? I only cook one at a time in my 36"..

I want to practice multiple pizzas at once in prep for larger parties. Those photos were just my wife and I making two pizzas. I didn't need to do them simultaneously. Short answer, yes, I have discovered that I can gingerly manipulate the pizzas around each other. It is quite difficult however. They were pretty small pizzas too, one of four dough balls from the FB ebook recipe (500g if I recall correctly), about 10 or 11 inches across.

And I let the dome go completely white before cooking for best results to tag on to what Raffy was saying about waiting to get the floor temp up.

Oh yeah, absolutely. Look at the photos again, I cleared the oven all the way down the sides in that last session (first time I've managed to clear it all the way to the floor). Literally all the soot burned off by the time I was putting pizzas in there. Are you recommending that even after the dome has fully cleared of all soot I should still continue to roar the fire for a while before cooking pizza? I've only done this four times so far, so I'm open to any and all suggestions. I'm just unsure what the point is of continuing the fire the oven once the dome has cleared. Everything is as hot as it's going to get at that point...right?

I usually just brush the floor well, then toss the pizzas on without mopping.

For pizza, I quickly shove the entire fire to one side of the oven, scrape and brush the exposed floor quickly, and throw on the pizzas, no wet mopping at all. For bread, two hours later, I wet-mopped the floor and threw down the dough (that last session was the first time I had put bread directly on the floor, so it was the first time I wet-mopped the floor). Worked quite well.

Thanks.

[kebwi]

Re: 36" in Seattle

Based on the pics you provided, I can only deduce that your cooking floor temp is too low. I cook my pizzas at around 400 - 425 degrees celsius resulting in a thin crunchy layer outside and a nice "bready" (for want of a better term) layer inside. If the bottom side takes too long to cook, it will result in a tough and chewy crust. If you say that you cook in the 600 F, roughly 315 C, I definitely think temperature is the culprit.
Raffy

Ah, I will have to give that some serious thought.

How soon after the firing do you start cooking? The dome gets hot pretty quick but its a matter of getting the cooking floor to "catch up" with the dome's temp. For a commercial oven (running 24/7), we had to wait one hour after firing til we could start cooking in the morning. Even when we could feel the blazing heat from the opening, we knew that the floor still wasn't hot enough til the prescribed waiting time was over.
Raffy

Well, I thought I was following standard FB Pompeii practice in that I fully clear the sought off the dome, then don't wait much longer. Once the dome cleared, I shoved the fire to the side, threw on a few small logs, and threw on the pizzas...but the floor was only 600, even though the dome was over 1000 and even the low walls were 800 or so.

Maybe after pushing the fire to the side and brushing off the floor, thus exposing it, I should roar the fire up again with the intention of shooting heat down into the bare floor...I just hadn't heard of other FBers needing to do that. I thought, once the soot clears, you make pizza.

Lastly, I recommend you wait a while after you have wiped the cooking floor with a wet rag. It may only be seconds but thats enough to reduce the cooking floor temp.

I'm not wet-mopping for pizza at all; only two hours later for bread. For pizza I raked the ash and coals to the back of the oven, brushed the floor vigorously, then went for it...at 600 for some confusing reason.

Food for thought. Thanks.

[Dino_Pizza]

Re: 36" in Seattle

Keith: Tell me how hour your "multiple pizzas at once" goes. Before I started the oven I'd spend hours on cad drawing various pizza 'circles' to verify how many pizza for the diameter will go in and verify the official downloaded ebooks pictures. We'll I've found it's all out the door. (or wfo?). I don't seem have the capacity (physically-mentally ) to keep my eye on more than 2 pizza's in the oven, watching when to turn them, watching when the closest one gets too done, then deciding which of the 2 comes out 1st AND I can't just wait and watch; I have to be getting my next 2 dough's ready. I can't imagine doing more than 2 at a time regardless of oven size.

If you teamed up with your wife or someone to prep the dough (but hey, your the best candidate for that) and have someone else tend the oven pizzas (if you can give up control, your a better man than I ) then it might work. I'll be really embarrassed if this problem is intrinsic to me only . -dino

[kebwi]

Re: 36" in Seattle

I admit, I'm torn by a desire to both shape the dough and tend the oven. Doing is kinda difficult. Not sure how it'll play out in a larger setting when I need to do multiple rounds instead of just two initial pizzas.