Typical heat up characteristic

[nachtwacht]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

I have tried it but only with ciabatta. Can not realy compare that to this kind of baking... the ciabatta's where only in the oven for a few minutes. I still have to (and want to) try the way he baked it but I usualy give big pizza party's and my oven is plenty hot the next day.

He also bakes on the floor, this is just one of the examples. I can only imagine he will put the bread in a corner, as far away from the fire as possible. If you put it close to the fire, it will ofcourse burn. Your oven therefore has to be big enough so you can move the fire to the left and bake on the right... I don't see why you should not be able to get the oven to 220 degrees and keep it there using a small fire adding wood if needed... It just does not seem to be something people do very often. This was actualy the first time I ever seen it in this video series. He does not only bake bread but also pies and a lot of other things this way.

Just give it a try I would say and for starters, keep the fire as small as possible or start with coals and take it from there. If the temp drops to much, you can add a small piece of wood....

Just make sure to let us know how it goes

[dimitrisbizakis]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

This is one of the examples. It realy is a life fire

Classic Chip Butty Recipe With Fresh Bread - The Fabulous Baking Brothers - YouTube

There are several episodes where they bake like this.

Have you ever try that?
It seems that with a live fire I can get it as low as 260 but it can get realy hot in there, I guess he has his eyes on and I think it's good for 1-2 loafs only.
And the tin...I realy like the baking to the floor.

[nachtwacht]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

This is one of the examples. It realy is a life fire

Classic Chip Butty Recipe With Fresh Bread - The Fabulous Baking Brothers - YouTube

There are several episodes where they bake like this.

[dimitrisbizakis]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

Also possible, why not use a fire while baking bread.... I recently seen a tv show (the fabulous baker brothers) wich used a stone oven (same size as we use) in their bakery. I was suprised they were baking breads and other things while still having a fire in the oven. If they can do it, why cant we
gl

Moisture is a big plus at bread baking and I don't know how well will it work, when you say fire, you mean a live fire or live coals?I guess they don't close the door and there wood must be really dry because ever a little moister in wood can give a very awful smell to bread.
I.ll try to find more about this episode you are referring.

[nachtwacht]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

After a half an hour it drops at 260c, perhaps the oven is still soaking heat and equalizing some points that are heated lower than some others.

Sounds to me like this is indeed happening.

Our ovens are roughly very simular (Mine is 11cm, also 5cm on the floor and insulation is about the same) but the outside of my stones is a lot lower in temperature than the inside after 1 hour of fire. (I can mesure the temperature on the inside but also the outside and below my floor) This means your oven is still equalizing so it looses temperature to the "outside" aswell as some through the inside.

If i fire my oven for more than i usually do, when i'm done with the pizza's i'll have to wait too long for the temp to drop so i could load the bread.

It's one or the other indeed. For your oven to work as good as possible at constant temperature, your oven has to be saturated as much as possible. That can be at 220 aswell as 350 degrees though.

You might try having a small fire before you start your big fire. Let this small fire burn for... lets say 3 or 4 hours.... This will get your oven to a nice hot temperature and probably also nicely soaked all the way through. Then you heat it up for pizza (this will now take a shorter time because it is allready nicely warm) and then let it cool down a little again (this will however now be slower because the heat is not soaking in like usualy anymore) I would think this would give you better retained heat for baking your bread.

Also possible, why not use a fire while baking bread.... I recently seen a tv show (the fabulous baker brothers) wich used a stone oven (same size as we use) in their bakery. I was suprised they were baking breads and other things while still having a fire in the oven. If they can do it, why cant we

gl

[dimitrisbizakis]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

You talk about baking pizza and apperantly not to long later you are allready at bread temperature..... Completely different from my oven. (4inch thick, 3 inch superwool insulation, me firing it up for 3 hours and then baking pizza for 2 hours with a life fire)

My dome is 10 cm thick, i have 10cm ceramic blanket and under the hearth ,which is 5 cm thick firebrick, i have 30 cm of perlcrete.
My door is 2 layers of ceramic blanket on a stainless steel box with a wood facing.

I don't bake my pizzas at super high temps.
I start from a cold oven and i maintain a medium fire for an hour or so.
With the live fire of one log in i can bake 3 pizzas at 260c without even the need to recharge the floor.
After i'm done with the pizza's i spread the coals (without any ash) to the floor.After half an hour i remove the coals, close the door and let it equalize. At that point i usually get a 280c temp.
After a half an hour it drops at 260c, perhaps the oven is still soaking heat and equalizing some points that are heated lower than some others.

If i fire my oven for more than i usually do, when i'm done with the pizza's i'll have to wait too long for the temp to drop so i could load the bread.
I guess i can't make everything works as i like too!

Pardon my english,self taught here

[nachtwacht]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

Now to the question, if I burn my oven longer, would I get longer maintain of a temp or this is a thermal mass problem?

Yes, I would think you need to burn your oven longer. I can not imagine that if you have an oven that has enough thermal mass to bake pizza's and breads etc, that you will have it at the right temperature after 1 hour of burning.

To get you a better answer, how thick are your bricks ? How hot is the oven when you bake pizza ? How much insulation did you use ? What kind of door (insulated or not) are you using ? etc. etc.

Mine is >350 celsius when I bake pizza and it takes to the next day before it has dropped to roughly 220. You talk about baking pizza and apperantly not to long later you are allready at bread temperature..... Completely different from my oven. (4inch thick, 3 inch superwool insulation, me firing it up for 3 hours and then baking pizza for 2 hours with a life fire)

[dimitrisbizakis]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

Hi everyone, may I ask what temp is the coocking temp?The temp that the oven has before you put your food in or after the temp drop?I am asking that because I get a roughly 15 degree temp drop whene I put a batch of 5 kg bread in.
I heat the oven for 1hour, I bake 3 pizzas in 30 min, spead the coals and leave it for 15 min, remove the coals and close the door to equalize, usaly at 250c.
When I load the batch the temp drops from 250 to 210, after an hour I remove the bread and close again the door, now it's at 200 now I put 40 cookies in and heat drops to 190, after an hour the I remove the cookies and after 20 min it's 185c.
I think the mass of my oven can hold a specific temp at say 210 c for an hour.
Now to the question, if I burn my oven longer, would I get longer maintain of a temp or this is a thermal mass problem?

[wotavidone]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

By building a "fast" fire using thin sticks (1 inch or less in diameter) I regularly get my thin dome cleared in less than an hour, usually 45-50 minutes from when I light the match, for mid-week pizzas. It is nowhere near fully saturated, it runs out of heat after 4 or 5 pizzas. To cook for a crowd I use a slower fire and let it go for at least 1.5 hours while I enjoy the social side. Seems to me that with the "fast" fire, I am applying heat quicker than the bricks can absorb it, so only the surface is up to temperature.

[thickstrings]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

If it were me, I'd try raking out the coals across the floor for 20 mins. or so with the door closed. Then adding some wood to bring some flame up for pizza. I might also consider the "dryness" of the fire wood. Mine heats up faster with wood that I have stored in the oven after the last use...still warm, no coals..Tinder dry ...poof!

[brickie in oz]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

Can you just partial heat the oven with sucess if you are just wanting to do a small quanity?

Now theres an interesting idea.

A split oven with a removable partition so you can reduce the oven size when needed.

[hodgey1]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

I can cook a pizza or 2 in mine in 45 minutes but it really needs a couple of hours for multiple pizzas

Tscar,
Can you describe a little more your method of firing the oven if your intensions are to just cook one or two pies. Can you just partial heat the oven with sucess if you are just wanting to do a small quanity? That would be awesome, because up untill now I've been cooking for the masses and now would like to do a mid-week pie for just my wife and I.

Thanks,
Chris

[deejayoh]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

If I am cooking a lot of pies I will move the banked fire from once side to the other at some point. Then I can cook where the fire was and the other side gets heated. Seems to work fine and takes 2 minutes.

[stonecutter]

Re: Typical heat up characteristic

If you waited a little longer during heat up, the oven will quickly recharge the floor, with a steady flame from a bed of coals. Moving pizza to different spots helps too.

That is the benefit of heating your oven longer before using it. There is more heat stored in the mass, and a steady fire will automatically recharge the floor. A saturated oven is better for oven management during use. And you won't have to shovel coals around and work harder to keep things even.

[hodgey1]

Re: Typical heat up characteristics

Hello All,

I completed the brick portion of my 42" WFO project about a month ago and have been using it regularly. The oven is working great, the floor and dome are heating up and staying hot nicely. I am firing my oven with seasoned hardwood "Cherry-Oak-Maple" from where I live in NW Pennsylvania and using the techniques described here and in the book "The Art of Wood Fired Cooking".

I thought I'd read along the way that the Pompeii ovens should be ready to cook pizza in 45 minutes, which would be really nice. From cold, my oven is taking around 90 to 120 minutes to clear dome, walls and have floor up to 750*. I'm able to turn out 10 pies before my floor drops below 650*.

While 1 1/2 - 2 hours isn't awful, I sure would prefer 45min. I'm not complaining because it is working great and turning out some beautiful pies. I'm more curious of what other peoples experiences are with their back yard builds that used medium duty fire bricks and the higher dome construction. My dome is 21" high with a arched inner opening is 12" at it's highest. Please respond if you would with the following in addition to any comments you may have.

. Size of WFO
. heat up time
. Your pizza cooking temps
. how often you have to recharge the floor when cooking multiple pies

Thanks,
Chris

It would seem from all the replies here that a 90 to 120 minute heat-up time for a oven is about the norm. Saturday night I cooked twelve 2 - 3 minute pies with a nice live fire. I started with a floor temp of 750* after 2 hr preheat, an 1 1/2hrs later and 10+ pies the floor had dropped down below 600* and needed recharged. Should have I preheated longer or just recharge once the floor temp started to dip?

If people could, please comment on their particular recharging of their oven floors during large events and cooking multiple pies in a row.

Chris