Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

[jdc]

I'm having a terrible problem with pizza sticking to my relatively new Primavera 60 oven. I first thought it was a new dough recipe I was using, but I've returned to the old one and the problem hasn't gone away. I was making pizzas fine for two months and now I can't seem to make one without it sticking.

The first pizza comes out okay, but then the sticking gets progressively worse. Attached is a photo of the residue left afterward -- not even the worst of it.

Any suggestions? If anything, I'd say my heat management has gotten better as I'm able to keep a good flame going throughout the baking process and hearth temperatures are between 800-900 degrees consistently.

[dmun]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

Are your pizzas leaking? This one has me stumped. Unless it's glued down with cheese, I can't think of anything that would make a pizza stick to a hot floor.

[biondoli]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

This is one explanation...:
when you have the balls ready for the second raise generally there is flour on top and under them to avoid that the balls will stick on the floor where they rest.
Now if you raise the balls without covering them with film paper or wet cloths, they will form some crust.
The crust is the result of the ball absorbing part of the flour on the bottom/top. Once in the oven these crusts will burn immediately and will try to absorb moisture from the ball which at this point will stick on the oven floor because the crust is already part of it. Hope this is clear...not easy to explain....ciao Carlo

[Mitchamus]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

are you making really thin pizza's?
could there be a tear in the bottom where toppings are leaking through?

Are you letting the prepared pizza's sit for a long time before they go in the oven?

Is your sauce very watery or thin?

Try one on a price of wax paper, and examine the paper after cooking to see if there is any leakage... Unless the paper sticks that is

[MK1]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

My experience says biondoli nailed it, if you wait a little longer to slide the turning peel under, the drier flour has separated and the crust won't tear.

Mark

[proprio italiano]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

it looks to me as if your dough is too wet. this, coupled with very high heat can cause the dough to stick and burn. i have had this problem on occasion. i have dealt with it best by flouring the side of the dough that i will place down and then spinning it from hand to hand just before placing it on the peel to get any excess flour off. you should try using cornmeal on the peel before you place the dough on it. if you can't solve it that way, you could try placing parchment paper on the peel and then placing the dough on the parchment paper. then slide the dough and parchment paper into the oven. hope some of this drivel helps you slve your problem sincerely, joe

[james]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

Is there something burned on the floor that you have not quite gotten clean with the brush? Burned attracts burned on the floor.

I don't think it is wet dough, but sauce or cheese that spills over the side of the pizza and gets caught on the cooking floor can burn and stick. Do you have enough flour? Personally, I don't like corn meal.

At 800?F, your pizza should not stick. :-)

James

[jdc]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

Thanks everyone for your ideas! The one that resonates most is that I'm using the turning peel too early. I say that because it's really the only change in conditions/methods that may have occurred between my early successful pizzas and my current unsuccessful ones... there aren't tears at all and I've made pizzas of various thicknesses and topping weights with no change in the problem... I've been making pizzas for a long time and on occasion have created the premature outside crust on my dough balls and so I know that's not it either.

If it is the early peel use, it makes some sense because when I had the problem once, I kept getting curious about whether it was happening with subsequent pizzas and so I'd peek early -- which would of course make the problem worse.

Thanks again to everyone and to Forno Bravo for this amazing forum! I'll be sure to report back either way.

[proprio italiano]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

i'll be interested to hear if using the pallino later rather than earlier solves the problem. from your picture, i dont think it will as i presume the burn marks you show are from your first placement of the pizza. i made pizzas for years in my father's restaurant in a commercial Baker's Pride oven which was gas fired and had a stone floor. we would keep the oven temp around 550 to 600 degrees F. often, the first pizzas of the night would burn on the bottom, similar to your picture. my father always said it was that the stone was too hot initially and had to cool down after its first pizza or two in a given area and he always suggested that i flour the first pizzas more heavily. now that i am working with a wood burning oven, i, too, am having some trouble with the bottom charring when the floor temps are high. so, you could consider this in your experiments to solve your problem. joe

[jdc]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

Thanks Joe, I will definitely report back. Based on your description though, the problem should get better, not worse over the course of the night and I've been having the opposite problem. The first one is the best and the last one is the worst... However, I do move the coals from one side to the other in between each pizza, so perhaps that recharging of the floor just keeps it too hot? Jeff

[proprio italiano]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

i missed the progressive worsening of the problem from first to last pizza in your first post. I'm baffled. i look forward to hearing more from you as you solve it.

[ThisOldGarageNJ]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

have you tried cooking a white pizza (without sauce) if it doesnt stick its your sauce bleeding thru the dough..... or just for experimenting, just cook a plain dough to see if it sticks...

[james]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

Hey jdc,

You should not have to move the coals while you are baking pizzas. The principle is that the heat radiating from the fire will bounce off the dome onto the floor, and the heat of the fire will migrate across the cooking floor. Between the two, you just have to keep feeding the fire -- you do not have to move the coals from side to side.

I have never seen an Italian pizzaiolo move a fire; they just keep feeding it -- and these guys bake hundreds of pizzas for dinner every evening.

James

[jdc]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

Success! I was, in fact, trying to turn the pizza too fast. Kinda reminds me of cooking meat on a grill -- if it sticks, it's not ready to flip over yet. Checking my stopwatch, it took at least a minute and sometimes up to two minutes before I could turn them -- with eventual bake times of 2-3:30. The only real problem was one pizza that got really burnt on the side positioned near the coals to start. The flames were probably too high and I had an unusually large amount of coals in there. It wasn't by best dough either since I made the "quick" version and didn't refrigerate overnight. Thanks so much for all your help! I feel like this huge weight is finally off my shoulders...

[asudavew]

Re: Pizza Sticking to Oven Floor

Are you sure about your temperatures... because that's a long time to cook a pizza at 800+
You should be able to turn your pie in about 30 seconds and have a cooked by in about 90.

Oh and the quick version is fine. Some people at my house prefer it. Are you adding more yeast to shorten the rise time.
If I make dough to retard overnight, I usually use 2 grams of yeast. But if I want to use it in a few hours, I go with 6 grams.