Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

[ronwass]

My wife is letting me build an oven in the yard, after many years of pleading (on my part).

She doesn't like the idea of a hulking mass of concrete in the yard. I kind of agree with her. especially since I want the mouth of the oven to be higher up to cook from the deck. Deck is about 3 feet above ground.

Attached, find an idea for a foundation that uses piers and pressure treated girders.

Maybe 5 piers total? 4 at the corners, and one in the middle?

Does anyone see any problems? If so, what would you change? If not, what size footers would you use? 8 or 10 inch?

Mostly interested in suggestions to attach and pour hearth slab to top of the wood.

Advantages of this is that it is absolutely not affected by frost. Also, saves a ton (or three) of concrete mixing and pouring.

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

Hello Ronwass, Are you crazy? The definition of crazy "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results." Or asking the same question over and over expecting a different answer.

I think we already discussed this here...
http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f6/f...ion-18829.html

What you need to consider is the pounds to the square inch of support to the total weight of the finished oven. 4 8x8' is 256 sq inches or 1.78 square feet. Not much support.

Also using piers that are not continuous to the load you will need to take into account any horizontal forces. So let's say the left side piers settle under the load you could have a tipping issue.

let's start there.

How tall will this base need to be to get the oven to the proper height to the deck?

[silvfox]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

If I recall correctly when we last discussed building on peirs it was concrete peirs. The limitations and requirements will be similiar for wood. You could use treated 6 X 6 southern yellow pine set four feet below grade on concrete pads. Four posts, no need for a center post. Diagonal knee bracing with 2 x 6's will prevent racking. Use bolts not screws or nails.
Four 2 x 12's bolted thru posts with sixteen 1/2" galvanixed bolts serve as beams. 2 x 10's set perpendicular on beams 12" on center for joists, all pressured treated lumber. The concrete slab could be poured on a deck of corrugated steel or durarock.

[ronwass]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

No, Faith, that last thread was about frost depth. This is about above ground structure.

This is something like what I am talking about although, obviously pier-ed into the ground in my case:

PhotoPlog - Hearth and Stand

Thank you for the info regarding the specifications. I'm going to examine them closely.

Regarding height, if I want to reach cooking height while standing on the deck, I need to add about 18 inches to standard height.

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

That picture was a great help.

What I would do if you want something like the picture but fixed to the ground. Dig your four footers to the frost depth. I would make a pad about 18 inches square 6 inches deep for each post (others may have other recommendations on size) But I think that will work fine. Then take your pressure treated posts and run them from the footer to the bottom of the stand as one piece. (make sure the pressure treated is rated for below ground)


Then I would make that lower shelf at the same height as your deck and through bolt it to the deck at that point.

That should work just fine. I have my oven set on logs so no problems with wooden bases. I also think that would look quite nice.

Faith

[silvfox]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

Faith it sounds like your on the same page as me with your suggestions and added more clarity to what I proposed. After seeing the photo my suggested lumber dimensions are overkill if the domed will just be stucco with no brick enclosure.
John

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

Hi John, Yes that photo was worth 1000 words. I think it will be very sturdy and will look quite nice.

[ronwass]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

Thank you both for the encouragement and specifics. I like your idea of the bottom shelf bolted to the deck.

Obviously that wasn't my picture and I may not make it exactly like that but I'll let u know how it comes along.

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

Ronwass,

We love pictures here so keep us up to date on your progress. If you have any structure questions about the base just ask. Then you get to the fun part...building the oven ;-)

Have fun!!!

[ronwass]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

Thanks so much for the advice.

Well here's a picture of my lame mock-up so the wife could see what a giant oven looked like in the yard.

Created it in a matter of minutes with stuff lying around in my garage. Fastest oven build here I'll bet. Least functional oven though.

[mrchipster]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

Thanks so much for the advice.

Well here's a picture of my lame mock-up so the wife could see what a giant oven looked like in the yard.

Created it in a matter of minutes with stuff lying around in my garage. Fastest oven build here I'll bet. Least functional oven though.

Looks like it will burn well ..... for a little while.

Chip

[brickie in oz]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

It seems that ppl are scared of the fact that these ovens get hot inside, hence the need to build them on the neighbours fence line.
They rarely get (or is that getten? ) hot on the outside if built correctly, so why do ppl build it so far away from the inside kitchen?

Mine is built 4 steps away from the back door (inside kitchen).

[mrchipster]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

Al, many of us in the US have restrictive fire codes and must build 10-20 ft or more from any combustables, this sometimes puts our ovens a great distance from the house.

I was lucky in my case having no wood decking or other srtuctures within 15 ft and it is near the kitchen. The funny part is that where the oven sits is about the only place in my back yard it could have gone without being within 15 ft of something that burns.

Chip

[ronwass]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

FYI: That place near the fence has already been ruled out as it blocks the neighbors view of something. I'm now much closer to the house and thinking of building right next to the deck next to the house, with a height capable of cooking from the deck.

[Ah Makdapitsa]

Re: Different kind of foundation. Am I crazy?

I agree with Mr Virginia's assessment of the loads. While the idea of building an oven you can use from your deck is a practical approach, I think you would want to re-evaluate your foundation. Bye the time your through designing it, your foundation may resemble the Tower of Pisa more than anything else.
Naturally, leaning ( or wind load may need to be considered because of both height, weight and wind. Note: I am a rookie oven builder, but I have built many buildings over the years. Look around, your problem is not unique, someone has had to already done this. Perhaps you can borrow their engineering.

We're all crazy, so what's the big deal ?