Countryboy build in SC, US

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Taking a break.. I'm whooped! Back hurts especially from bending. Can't figure out how to build and sit at the same time, so spending a lot of time bending over. I guess I need a small pail I can transfer mortar into and that might help!!

Finished the fifth and sixth rings with part of the seventh completed.

Messy work site, but here are a few pics. As previously stated, I have not done this in the exact order most do. The outer arch is complete and I know exactly how I will build the wall structure behind it. Just have to get my mind wrapped around the chimney before I tackle it. I think I can start on it after I finish the seventh or eighth course as I hope to angle it back very slightly to keep it from being too close to the stuccoed hardibacker that will be immediately behind the outer arch.

Pics in this post and the next... Took six at my stopping point.

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Have covered a little more ground, but need to get some pics up to 'prove' it..

I haven't exactly been doing this in the traditional order... Too excited about finding just the right bricks and stone for the front arch and I want to tie them in well with the chimney and first arch as I finish the dome... So, yesterday I finished the outer arch as well as the fourth course.

This afternoon I was so looking forward to getting more of the dome up, but it started pouring rain just as I pulled in the drive after work.

I pickled some okra (HOT and sweet!!) and ate dinner with the vain hope of it clearing... After dinner I wandered out and it looked like the storm had passed, so I piddled a while cleaning the brick at the front and removing the form for the outer arch. After a bit I was sure the storm had passed so I pulled out my saw and began cutting brick for the fifth course. Next I mixed a batch of mortar and about the time I had it the right consistency I heard thunder!!

I could see the horizon turning black so I got to work at the fastest pace I could manage, only I had the bricks very wet (have struggled with dryness as a problem in the previous courses... but then, it was hotter in the middle of the day, sun shining, etc...) and the fifth course is just starting to tip enough to make the bricks want to slide... Fun!! I was frantically placing and bracing bricks. I got 80% of the fifth course done when I ran out of mortar. That coincided with mammoth rain drops beginning to pelt me and my work space!

Noticing the saw and electric cord still out I quickly ran them in to the shop before washing my mortar pan and wetting the recently finished brickwork... Covered it in plastic and then headed for shelter from the down pour!!

I did notice as I worked this evening that my saw blade is about shot, so first thing tomorrow morning I will get a new one so I can (hopefully) lay the sixth and seventh rings tomorrow!!

Question: How much more complicated does the cutting get? I noticed in the fifth that a simple angle across the bricks was no longer going to work. Some bricks worked with a tapered angle across the brick, but some needed a second cut to fit well.. What is the best way to accomplish this? I know I've seen different ideas on how to do this, but have read way too many threads to remember which/where to find that info.

Pics tomorrow!!

Thanks,

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Time for an update...

Over the last few days I've had time to mortar in the second and most of the third course while thinking through the inner and outer arches.

Also, over the weekend I picked up 20 brick from an abandoned chimney that was left after a 100+ year old building burned. The bricks are a purplish color, solid and appear to be hand made. All are very similar in size, but have slight twists and bends to them... LOTS of character!

Today was my day off and I started early with a trip to take the kids for some blood work. (Nothing serious.) Stopped by a stone dealer on the way home to look for a suitable piece for a landing and a nice looking key stone for the outer arch. Had a good chat with the guy that was fetching rocks. Young. Said his family owned the very nice establishment. I asked a dozen questions about the stones, made a selection at 22?/lbs and then he off and tells me 'No charge." SWEET!!

So, we jetted home and I started to work. After about five hours I have the inner arch done and all is tied in to the outer bases on either side. The outer arch is laid out, but I still have to make a form for it. Thursday will be my next work day.

I did finish a nice reveal for the inner arch and the opening flairs slightly to the antique brick for the front. Working with them was interesting!! Also, as I was wrapping up my inner arch an idea for a little detail hit me, so I did it... (See the pics)... Only after I was finished did it dawn on me that the inner arch may be blackened by soot. Oh well. I can enjoy it for now. Pretty!

Pics below. Please give comments.

Thanks for the ton of ideas and instruction on this site. Sure makes the actual work easier!

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Finished mortaring in the soldiers early this morning and then cut and test fit the brick for the second and third courses before having to take a quick shower and head to an appointment.

Late this afternoon I had time to play while waiting on a guy that I am helping build some bee hives. ( I have two home built top bar hives and we are building four more together.. two for him, two for me...) Anyway, I knew better than to mix mortar with him expected to show at any time, so I started to cut and dry fit the inner arch sides with a reveal.

Nothing except the soldiers in the pics are mortared. If you experienced/wiser guys see something amiss, please point it out. All recommendations welcome!

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Got a little more done this evening after work.

My second son and I cut all the soldier course brick before dinner, then after my eldest and I started trying to figure out and cut the transition bricks for the inner arch. The reveal adds an additional degree of difficulty to each brick, but we managed a template and the first brick on each side.

Next we mixed some mortar and started mortaring and placing the soldiers. Initially went fine, but noticed the mortar drying too fast.. About the same time several friends popped in to tour the greenhouse and aquaponic system... My son was distracted by a daughter that came with the guys and suddenly I had an audience, no help and a pile of mortar!

So, I remembered to dip the bricks to get them wet and that solved the quick dry issue. I tried to extol the virtues of a WFO to my new found audience while getting the soldiers mortared! One friend was kind enough to refill my mortar pallet each time it emptied saving me that trouble. The end result was okay, though I was glad to reach the bottom of the mortar and throw the tools in a bucket of water... The pressure was a bit much for my very limited bricklaying experience.

They left an hour later and it was too dark to do any more, but I was able to clean the course a little and guess I'll get an early start tomorrow to try to finish the soldier course before the heat sets in.

Pics later.

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Thanks, John. That thread was informative. As far as my sons, (I have four) I am trying to do with them what my father did with me. He could build or fix anything. He had an amazing mechanical mind and I received some of his 'out of the box' thinking with maybe a little more craftsmanship. Now people tell me I can do anything, though I believe anyone who applies him/herself to reading and is willing to make a few mistakes to learn can do the same.

My eldest is now 14, and lately he has taken a much greater interest in working and learning. I've been very proud of his attention span and growing repertoire of skills. I promised he would be doing much of the cutting once we start on the rings. I figure I can set up a fixture to help him duplicate cuts and let him get a little experience while a younger brother handles the water and I can be mortaring.

On a related [soapbox]: I tell my boys all the time how important it is that they develop a work ethic. It drives me crazy to see the number of young people today who would rather watch the toob or play video games and brag about virtual 'accomplishments.' A few skills and a solid work ethic will go a LONG way in the next generation! [/soapbox]

Now to read up and solve this transition to arches... I can put the soldiers in this afternoon after I make my 'indispensable tool,' but need a clear picture of the inside arch before that so I can get it right the first time!

Off to read!

CB

[GianniFocaccia]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

CB,

Looking good, your build is moving along nicely!

I too had to hunt around for my vermiculite and was jealous to find out you paid roughly half what I did here in southern cal ($27/bag I think) without cement.

There have been many builders here with reports of excellent results of homebrew mortar. A good explanation and the recipe can be found here:

http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f6/high-heat-mortar-primer-914.html?highlight=sticky+mortar

It's nice to see that your able-bodied son has signed on as your assistant and partner for your build. He will no doubt take forward the building experiences and problem-solving approaches he learned from his Dad.

John

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Hi CB, sounds like good progress.

Last weekend I did have an issue with a chicken getting too hot too quickly in there, so I pulled it out and put it on the oven roof - then forgot about it. Went to bed, suddenly had a panic about the chicken that had been left in the oven and must be burnt to a crisp, ran outside about midnight to find it on the oven roof still - slightly undercooked but at least not burnt

Now that is funny! I hate suddenly sitting up in bed with a panic thought... Hard to get over the adrenalin rush and get back to bed.

CB

[BackyardPermaculture]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Hi CB, sounds like good progress.

Another question for you guys out there... How much do you really use hearth space around the front/opening of the oven?

My oven is close to my kitchen bench, so I really don't miss the big landing that I initially had in mind. I think that if you have large counters nearby, there's no need for a large landing.

Last weekend I did have an issue with a chicken getting too hot too quickly in there, so I pulled it out and put it on the oven roof - then forgot about it. Went to bed, suddenly had a panic about the chicken that had been left in the oven and must be burnt to a crisp, ran outside about midnight to find it on the oven roof still - slightly undercooked but at least not burnt

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Now I have to go back and look at a dozen different threads on here to get a mental image of what I am trying to accomplish tomorrow evening... I have the soldiers figured out, but the transition through the first arch to the second will take some forethought.

Another question for you guys out there... How much do you really use hearth space around the front/opening of the oven? With so much counter space around the oven I am debating whether or not I need a cantilever landing much bigger than the area between the flared door opening walls. Thoughts?

And, I think it is time to build an indispensable tool....


Thanks for the help and comments.

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Got more done today...

Felt like I spent all day hunting down supplies. The real difficulty was finding some vermiculite.

The first pool place was ZERO help. The even acted like he had no idea what it was... The next place was little help until they realized that I wasn't trying a pool repair on my own but was building a WFO.

Still, they didn't have any on hand and said it would be hours before they could get a delivery truck to bring some by the store. I explained I was 50 miles from home and they were generous enough to start making calls for me... Long story short, it was still two hours and 40 miles of driving before I had the goods, but at $13/bag premixed with cement, it was hard to beat. Bought four bags and the job took three.

Loaded the brick at a brickyard and asked for Heat Stop 50 or similar refractory mortar... The guy looked at me like I was crazy. I explained what I'm doing and he claimed that local contractors working in wfo ovens in local restaurants (I know of only two... ) and in kiln work use mortar and fireclay in a 2:1 ratio. He called a sales rep that covers this region and the claim was confirmed.

So, question for you guys: I purchased one bag of fireclay at $18 and have mortar mix on hand... Do I go with that (I know the Pompeii v2 manual offers that as a 'cheaper option'), and what is the difference in life expectancy of the mortar/oven? OR, do I stop the progress and look harder/order some from the other side of the planet, er.., country?

[Makes me wonder, what did they use for mortar 150 or 1500 years ago? Hmmmm..... How long have some of those ovens survived?]

Can you tell I am leaning toward moving forward, but want clear direction if that is ill advised...

Once home, my eldest and I mixed the vermicrete and put it in place. Seemed soupy, but followed the FBF lead...

Next we stalled on the oven by removing concrete forms and watering all concrete again. Have left the under oven stand support in place for at least two or three more days.

Then we started laying out the floor and cutting brick. I have a metal chop saw that I decided to use instead of a wet/masonry saw. I did spring for a blade that is worth more than the saw.. I paid about $130 for the blade. Just as we were getting set up it dawned on me ( light bulb over head smilie) that we have a small two gallon sprayer for weeds/bugs, etc... A couple years ago we started to avoid all chemicals on the property and have since used it to spray salt water on weeds, etc... (So, it is clean...)

Anyway, I told my son to fill it with water, pump the pressure up and use it to wet the bricks where I was cutting. Worked like a charm! I gave careful instruction to him to be sure no overspray hit the motor on the saw, but the size of the blade and relatively sealed housing was insurance enough.

We cut the hearth bricks and then, with the vermicrete starting to firm up, decided to set them onto the surface of the 5" thick insulating pad. Wet down the rest of the concrete, sat and enjoyed a Corona, then had dinner.

Long productive day... Happy.

Pics...

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

SURPRISE!!!

Didn't think I would get to do any more work until tomorrow, my normal day off... Well, yesterday afternoon late I was told that today would be a paid holiday as long as no immediate work came in (I work in a funeral home...).

So, I started early today hoping to not get 'the call.' Ultimately, I worked hard early, then piddled much of the afternoon in tying up loose ends and getting ready for the next step.

Tomorrow I am off, so going to buy brick and vermiculite. Plan to have the vermicrete pad poured by the end of the day and have my brick hearth cut and laid out!!

Pics follow. I pulled the forms for the edges of the counters and for the sink. Both look good. I will continue to keep them wet for the next few days. Notice the rounded/bullnose edge of the counter!! Turned out pretty good! Needs a few minor touchups, but over all I am very happy with how $8 of wallyworld plastic edging made a nice edge. Once polished, stained and sealed, I think the counters will look nice!!

Also, I stuck a pic in of the corner where we laid a few block for the foundation of the fireplace... Still debating some details on that side, but the fireplace itself is set in stone... so to speak...

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

More pics... end of day.

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

'Nother big day on what is quickly becoming an outdoor kitchen... Wifey is glad... Maybe the hard work will pay dividends..

Worked until after noon trying to finish the forms to have a continuous pour for both counters and the oven hearth slab. Nearly pulled it off, but more on that in a minute.

Wife picked up a small stainless sink yesterday, so I had to think through the reverse form to make the lip for bolting it down, etc.. Also decided to add a hole/indentation for a cutting board next to the sink.

Caught a clue from someone on this forum about an 'accident' using plastic edging creating a nice bull nose, so decided to try using some for the form on the front of my counter tops. I screwed it securely to the lower form with about 3" spacing, then used a 2x4 at an angle to present a rigid edge just under the round lip at the top of the edge material. It left a nice bulge on the front for the length of each counter... We'll see how it turns out after the forms come off...

I also used a strip of a blue 55 gal. drum to form the front of the hearth support area in a nice round shelf. (The pic shows a warped barrel, but after we got it in place the sun warmed it up nicely and then we used a couple screws and sticks to pull it into a very nice looking arc...)

Ultimately ran about 8-10 bags short and have a bit left to pour on the hearth slab. I formed a ring around the outside with a low spot in the middle for vermicrete. As it turns out the edges all around need to be filled to finish the job, so in one respect, the hearth will almost wind up as a floating hearth if the second pour doesn't adhere really well to the first... Guessing no harm, but at first was a little concerned.

Now some pics of mid day progress. Next post with end of day progress.

Questions, comments, thoughts, recommendations welcome!

Thanks,

CB

[countryboy]

Re: Countryboy build in SC, US

Tired... Late in the work day I was wiped out and having trouble thinking/concentrating... By the end of the day I was wandering around moving stuff and getting nothing done. That's when I knew it was time to stop!

I am very happy with the day's results as evidenced by the pics below... A few small glitches, but overall we rocked. (Pun intended... )

Still have some work to do on the forms and a few things to think through to make sure I get the best result my amateur hands are capable of, but should be able to pour the oven slab and the counter tops on Saturday if I don't get called in to work.

The first couple pics are 'in progress' and the last couple are the 'end of day' pics. Helpers in the are pic for scale only... (Actually, they are a lot of help, though not strong enough to move bags of cement or pick blocks up to the third/fourth course. So, dad got a big workout!)