Jim's Build for the Common Man

[Tscarborough]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

You won't have to fire it for 4 hours for a couple of pizzas, but for more than a few, 4 or 5 hours is the best means to success. You don't need a roaring fire the whole time, just one that licks the ceiling with flame.

[jimkramer]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

I never posted the final product at the end of last fall, so here it is. I also never posted the pic of me inside the oven. I figure this is like a compulsory move in olympic gymnastics, you gotta do it.

We've fired it up six or seven times. Just today, I'm able to get the floor to stay between 650-720F for my daughter's birthday party. Pizza is finally getting to be delicious. Previously, temps were often dipping to 400, while the dome was much hotter. But today, it was all much hotter and more even. I fired it up for about four hours, just hope I don't always have to do that. I think I'm still driving out lots of moisture in the floor insulation, since it got soaked several times.

[Greenman]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

Congratulations. Looks like the start of a beautiful friendship. It just gets better as you go.

[jimkramer]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

It's like a birth announcement:

First pizza 10/26/14, 6:49PM.

Actually, the very first one (before the on in the picture) got folded in half, full of ashes, and had to be thrown into the fire. Very fitting.

[cobblerdave]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

Holy crap, the brickwork is done, and I started curing fires! I am litterally having difficulty falling asleep I'm so excited about getting to pizza time.

I did two nights of charcoal briquette fires (first night was paper balls for an hour, then charcoal). Had them going for about 3 hours, and temp very slowly reached about 190F once I put up a temporary cement board in front of the vent entrance. Put in more charcoal, then went to sleep. I hope the temp climbed a bit more. Tonight I'll start the fb prescribed schedule, 300, then 350, then go to 450, so I can get to 550 to cook pizza when my bro & fam visit Saturday. I think I'll insulate Sat AM, then start stucco dome Sunday.

After I get to 550 am I done with curing? Or should I do 650, 750 max temps first before I get to 900?

G'day
If course you can cook pizza at lower temps.... And I bet you'll impress yourself as well. It will be the best tasting pizza
You just get better later with practice
Regards dave

[jimkramer]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

Holy crap, the brickwork is done, and I started curing fires! I am litterally having difficulty falling asleep I'm so excited about getting to pizza time.

I did two nights of charcoal briquette fires (first night was paper balls for an hour, then charcoal). Had them going for about 3 hours, and temp very slowly reached about 190F once I put up a temporary cement board in front of the vent entrance. Put in more charcoal, then went to sleep. I hope the temp climbed a bit more. Tonight I'll start the fb prescribed schedule, 300, then 350, then go to 450, so I can get to 550 to cook pizza when my bro & fam visit Saturday. I think I'll insulate Sat AM, then start stucco dome Sunday.

After I get to 550 am I done with curing? Or should I do 650, 750 max temps first before I get to 900?

[Greenman]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

Jim - This link shows arch loadings and how to manage them. Hope it helps.

Auroville Earth Institute

[jimkramer]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

I have to buttress the vent arch. I'll be using 7"ID/24" high clay flue, and buttress it with the extra fire bricks left over. How many should I use on each side? How high does the buttress have to go? I would think I have to use enough weight to at least equal the weight of the flue, right?

[Greenman]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

There are so many variables when it comes to curing an oven. How much water was used during the construction, how long has it taken to get to that stage, what levels of heat and humidity have been involved............

In the middle of a hot dry summer getting rid of the moisture happens automatically. During an Irish winter moisture accumulates rather than dissipates and everything in between.

It really is about understanding the principles and applying some good sense to your own situation.

I used wood and paid attention to the thermometer. The two ovens I have helped people with that are being fired this week are being cured with wood and even if people are time poor it really is a time to start to understand your oven and if you are a bit touchy feely then you will bond with it during this time.

Some things need to happen organically. There is no comprehensive manual for this one.

[UtahBeehiver]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

I used charcoal several time and got into the mid 200s

[jimkramer]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

Thanks for the info, guys. I'll try charcoal briquettes for the first couple, and see how hot I can get with that.

From reading a long thread about curing: http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/16/o...ng-767-15.html, it seems that it's okay to insulate the dome first, before or during the curing process. I had previously thought this would keep too much moisture in the dome, but the upside seems to be you can keep the temp steadier for longer during the curing. I think I'll do this, as it will speed things up, so I can get to the outer stucco before the night time temps get too cold. Any big concerns?

[UtahBeehiver]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

Coal fired pizza restaurants are quite popular in NYC. Here is a little blurb on coal fire vs wood fired ovens I found.

What is a Coal Fired Oven -- .Coal-burning ovens are hot commodities for pizza makers since the only way to get one in New York City is to inherit it. Coal fired ovens have a long history to pizza making in the US. New York City was the birth place of New York style pizza. Lombardi's which opened in 1905 was the first pizzeria in the United States, and it happened to use a coal-fired oven.

One of the main differences between coal and wood comes not from the coal smoke but by the intense heat a coal fire generates. Coal provides about 13,000 BTUs of heat per pound, while wood provides about 6,500 BTUs per pound. Oven temperatures in a coal fired oven exceed 900 degrees imparting a characteristic char to the crust. In addition the higher heat lets the crust get crispier

But I still like my WFO...........

[cobblerdave]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

G'day Steve
That's why I use "heat beads " and charcoal" together.
Saves confusion ( I hope )
Regards dave

[Greenman]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

Not using coal is probably about the more intense heat that is possible and not least, the smoke (and its qualities) that it emits.

I would not like my food to taste like the smell of burning coal or the smoke from it.

[cobblerdave]

Re: Jim's Build for the Common Man

G'day Jim
Could not tell you with any certainty why. But I can tell you a cast oven is different
The floors are on the whole thinner and built in 4 quarters perhaps they might crack from uneven heat if they had a heat source in the middle where the come together. They have less residual water left in them and don't need dry heat like a home built? Charcoal would certainly couldn't take the oven to pizza heat by itself. They designed for wood with flames.
Home built have heaps of residual water which if turned to steam with high heat fires could lead to cracking. The need is there to remove as much of that water first before those higher heat fires.
The hearth is made of brick usually thicker in a home build plenty of stress cracks already built in.
I've seen plenty of ovens cracked over my time on the forum. So I believe in seeing them dried first without render first before flames and high heat .
Its impossible to tell if an oven is still to wet for any given heat range to advise anyone...so I always advocate low slow drying before starting the curing fires.
Regards dave