40" corner build in central TX

[stonecutter]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

Boy, my numbers were a bit dyslexic...but you got the point. The code I referred to was ICC...the IRC section R1003.9 Termination. Different acronym, same numbers.

[ogorir]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

"IBC section 2113.9 Termination. Chimneys shall extend at least 2 feet (610 mm) higher than any portion ofthe building within 10 feet (3048 mm), but shall not be less than 3 feet (914 mm) above the highest point where the chimney passes through the roof."

The oven is located 15 feet from both the garage and the house (local portable open flame ordinance) so I'm hoping that 3' is fine, as that's my plan

I'll probably just frame it up for a standard front chimney... I still have to tear out the old insulation in the attic, seal up, install radiant barrier, blow in new insulation... before the first.

[stonecutter]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

The center chimney is what I'm after. How do you mean angling the flue? come up straight, then come back over the insulation and turn up again at the middle?

Yup, but you wont be able to do it with clay flue unless you use strapping


My non-aesthetic reason for contemplating center chimney is support. I have no idea if I'm going to get green tagged until I extend the chimney above the house roof, which I'm really not planning for, but I would have an easier time managing if the stack were centered on the dome. At least, I think I would. I didn't leave enough hearth stand on either side of the entryway to do any major buttressing.

I don't know how high you need to go, but the last time I checked, IRC minimum clearance was 3' above the roof edge, 2' above the ridge on a gable end. That should be easy to check online.


I agree with you on the heat-transfer aspect of a true squirrel tail. the outside of the dome brick is going to take a proper long time to get anywhere near the temp of the inside, so while it may have an effect, it's probably not going to be relevant until your oven is heat-soaked. and by then, what's the point? as far as it goes, though, I think it'd be easier to run 3 courses of firebrick up the front of the dome than it would to angle that terracotta flue pipe.

I think you should do whatever you feel like, mainly because it doesn't matter how you run the flue as long as you get a good draw.


It's mostly idle thought right now, I'm going to need to do the archway pretty much the same either way, so I'm going to get that done first. Then the landing overhang thing. At this point, I'm (predictably) regretting penny pinching on the base slab and block stand. I could've easily made it 8" larger both directions and been much more comfortable.

Lessons learned if you build another one.

[ogorir]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

Thanks Russell, I find it easy to pay attention to details when I'm having fun.

[UtahBeehiver]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

nice brickwork on dome. congrats on the plug.

[ogorir]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

The center chimney is what I'm after. How do you mean angling the flue? come up straight, then come back over the insulation and turn up again at the middle?

My non-aesthetic reason for contemplating center chimney is support. I have no idea if I'm going to get green tagged until I extend the chimney above the house roof, which I'm really not planning for, but I would have an easier time managing if the stack were centered on the dome. At least, I think I would. I didn't leave enough hearth stand on either side of the entryway to do any major buttressing.

I agree with you on the heat-transfer aspect of a true squirrel tail. the outside of the dome brick is going to take a proper long time to get anywhere near the temp of the inside, so while it may have an effect, it's probably not going to be relevant until your oven is heat-soaked. and by then, what's the point? as far as it goes, though, I think it'd be easier to run 3 courses of firebrick up the front of the dome than it would to angle that terracotta flue pipe.

It's mostly idle thought right now, I'm going to need to do the archway pretty much the same either way, so I'm going to get that done first. Then the landing overhang thing. At this point, I'm (predictably) regretting penny pinching on the base slab and block stand. I could've easily made it 8" larger both directions and been much more comfortable.

[stonecutter]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

Speaking of chimney, has anyone done a squirrel-tail recently? I may need to be talked out of doing one

Not recently, but I have done a few on historic beehive ovens. Why do you want to do one? It isn't going to benefit you, except if you want a center chimney, and that you can get by angling your flue.

Neapolitan vents have that style in front of the oven, unlike the ones I have done, which are rear vented. Neo oven builders claim a better draw from heat exchange from the uninsulated dome ( directly under the flue) into the flue chase. I have serious doubts about the practicality of that method, but that isn't the point.

It would be a conversation piece, and a lot of extra figuring if you haven't done it before. But who cares....it's your oven, do what you want.

I am designing another oven right now, which will have a traditional Neapolitan vent/chimney. But I am adding a layer of insulation over the dome before I build the flue over it. Consider doing the same if you go that route.

[ogorir]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

alright, I fit the second plug in the top which I was able to get it out of the other half of the brick I used for the first plug. the mortar joint wound up a little big, between 1/4" and 3/8" but I wasn't going to re-do it over that.

It's a good thing I'm small and not claustrophobic, because I had to get inside the dome to finish grinding the arch tie-in. great time for the angle grinder to melt a winding and throw sparks around, right? After that excitement, I went over to HF and got a new grinder.

I decided to remove the bottom bricks I laid for the tapered arch because I had them cut and mortared solid to the dome arch and I wanted to taper them in and leave them un-mortared for a thermal break. I got 7 of 8 up before I ran out of mortar and called it a night.

I need to solicit some opinions for a hearth landing. I laid out my oven with the intent of having the dome arch tangent to the inner circle of the dome(like most people...) but it wound up tangent to the outer circle(derp) so I've lost 4.5" of landing in the front and I need to add more real estate.
The first option I'm looking at is cutting 2 notches into the 3rd course of brick above the storage arch, drilling in some rebar, and casting a monolithic butress/counter with concrete. I'd probably make the landing semi-circular to get more effective real estate with less weight.
My other thought is to do basically the same thing, but do it pre-cast so I can control the form better and cast it upside down on melamine. I think I could also make it a bit thinner this way and use the glass fiber reinforcement.

The real problem I'm not sure how to address is how to tie the counter into the existing structure, as there's only a scant 5" of surface outboard of the oven floor. The hearth slab is level with the top of the 2nd course of brick around the perimeter and it's poured up to the back of the face course above the storage arch, so I guess I can drill and anchor into that if I have to.

I really need to get this sorted out quick, I'm tired of messing up the floor in the archway because there's nothing hemming it in:/

[kbartman]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

Thanks, KB. I'm hoping to get the outer arch done this weekend and re-set the center floor bricks, then next week tackle the chimney.

Speaking of chimney, has anyone done a squirrel-tail recently? I may need to be talked out of doing one

Not much eating on his tail.... I would cook the body instead

[ogorir]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

Thanks, KB. I'm hoping to get the outer arch done this weekend and re-set the center floor bricks, then next week tackle the chimney.

Speaking of chimney, has anyone done a squirrel-tail recently? I may need to be talked out of doing one

[kbartman]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

Congratulations, Nice work you'll be cooking soon.

[ogorir]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

So I just finished the dome*!

*I decided to do the plug in two vertical layers instead of two pieces split down the middle. Aesthetics. I only cut the inner plug, I'll do the outer tomorrow. The outer may be in two pieces, the hole was ~2.75" on the inside, so one full brick might not cover.

I will share how I marked my plug, which while not perfect, got it fit in the hole first try. I cut a brick in half, mortared one of the large faces, and stuck the mortar into the hole from the inside. That leaves a pretty decent impression in the mortar that's exactly the shape of the hole. I used my trowel to cut away the mortar outside the plug area, then used the dry grinder to mark the top so I could wash the mortar off. Then I used the wet saw with the head bevel eyeballed to the taper of the hole and cut along my lines. Had I done a better job transferring the imprint in the mortar down to the brick, it would've been a bit tighter, but as it was, it sat in the hole about 1/8" below the inside of the dome. I mortared the hole(instead of the brick) and tapped it in, ended up going a bit far and having to tap it back up a hair, but it all turned out way better than I expected.

It has been a lot of fun, but... Glad. That's. Done.
I should be pretty well set, curing wise, to do the turkey in it which is what I've been stressing over. I'll try to knock out the outer arch this weekend, which leaves me a while to figure out a door solution.


*Edit* I've used a single pair of black 9mil nitrile gloves from Harbor Freight for the last 3 courses. They've shown no signs of wear. They're way more expensive than the 'normal' 5mil gloves, but even at $11.50/50ct box, they're a good deal. I used a 25% coupon on them as well, so it was right around $10 w/tax. I'd highly recommend them for this purpose.

[ogorir]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

Good call, stonecutter! and I have a pointer I can modify.

I finished course #12 and got the first brick set for #13 (unsupported). I'm cutting the bricks into 4 pieces now, still just using the head bevel on the saw. It's a hair under 22.5 degrees for course #13 for me.

Course 12 was mostly round, but there is a little bit of distortion above the archway remaining.

(I keep forgetting to actually hit post. I just plugged the dome, but I'll put that in the next post.)

[stonecutter]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

I'd need about 10 sizes, so I will continue to remove my epidermis until I'm done setting bricks...

I meant to tell you, get a 3/8" tuck pointer, cut off 1/2 the blade, then starting about 1" from the end, taper it to a point. The short blade will allow better dexterity, and your pointing mix should be stiffer than your setting mix, allowing you to hold some in your hand....tucking it in with the modified pointer.

I made one 13 years ago, and every so often, it come in handy in tight areas.

[david s]

Re: 40" corner build in central TX

I don't like using gloves because I can't feel what I'm doing so well. I use a good quality barrier cream instead.it does wear off but does a pretty good job. It is the lime in the mortar that is the culprit. The hands do get used to it though. Also try washing hands in vinegar when done.