New oven design ideas

[RandyJ]

Well my house is sold along wht my oven. So now it is time to start thinking about what i want in the next one.

the things i really liked about the first oven were the size and heat retention abilities of it. So i plan to do a similar setup of 4"of calsil board and atleast 3 maybe 4" of blanket. Then i will probably add vermiculite over the top of that.

the main thing i disliked about the oven was the thermal conductivity of the floor. I l really like to cook at 800 and above but the floor i have will start to burn things quickly at that point, so i am planning to get this.

https://www.fontanaforniusa.com/coll.../saputo-stones

i plan to have full fire bricks below for additional heat retention and stability. This should allow for cooking at up to 900F or slightly above. Since the small set is 41" that will be the size i would go with. Can anybody see a reason this is not a great idea.

i will keep adding to this thought. I welcome all ideas.

Randy

[Chach]

Wow wish I knew about this a few weeks ago lol. Always something new or something you mever knew existed comes along. Im not sure how thick the material is I didnt look but I wonder for existing ovens if you take your floor brick out and slice it thinner reinstall and put this product on top if that would work out good so you still retain the same internal dome height.

[RandyJ]

You are still on your first chane you could just set it on top of your oven floor. That is what i am planning to do . My guess is it around 1 to 1.5" thick. Just put a layer of fire clay down and call it good. Then just move your pivot point to there and go.

[Chach]

i emailed the company after I wrote the post to you and this is what they sent...this can make anyone retrofit a floor like this in their existing oven.

Hi Ricky,


The traditional 41" saputo stones are approximately 1.25" (3.1cm) thick.

[david s]

Well my house is sold along wht my oven. So now it is time to start thinking about what i want in the next one.

the things i really liked about the first oven were the size and heat retention abilities of it. So i plan to do a similar setup of 4"of calsil board and atleast 3 maybe 4" of blanket. Then i will probably add vermiculite over the top of that.

the main thing i disliked about the oven was the thermal conductivity of the floor. I l really like to cook at 800 and above but the floor i have will start to burn things quickly at that point, so i am planning to get this.

https://www.fontanaforniusa.com/coll.../saputo-stones

i plan to have full fire bricks below for additional heat retention and stability. This should allow for cooking at up to 900F or slightly above. Since the small set is 41" that will be the size i would go with. Can anybody see a reason this is not a great idea.

i will keep adding to this thought. I welcome all ideas.

Randy

The larger any casting is the greater the propensity to cracking, hence the casting in four sections. Biscotto is Italian for biscuit and presumably refers to the temperature the castings are fired to which is generally 1000 C.This lower temperature combined with an open clay body produces very good thermal shock resistance. Before Forno Bravo began casting their ovens using castable refractory they were importing biscotto ovens from Italy. The Italians have been making these ovens using these materials for a long time and have surely perfected the technique. I'll be interested to know how they go for you.

[RandyJ]

i emailed the company after I wrote the post to you and this is what they sent...this can make anyone retrofit a floor like this in their existing oven.

Hi Ricky,


The traditional 41" saputo stones are approximately 1.25" (3.1cm) thick.

cool thanks for getting that information. That is what i assumed they would be. If you added it to yours now it would not be a huge issue and then you just fir out the entry with fire brick splits. It would be a option for you. I am 99 9% sure i am going that way.

Randy

[Chach]

sounds amazing but $500 is tuff to swallow. The thing is you know how the oven worked and now your trying to rectify what you did not like on the new build which is really smart...you would have something to compare it too. im not sure one way or the other. i dont want to be the guinea pig lol although i may. id have to cut it to fit inside my 36" floor...i wonder how good that stuff cuts. I will have to really think this through before i build my arch.

[RandyJ]

completely agree with you that the 500$ is unnecessary. I am not trying to push you in to spending money you don't need to. I was just trying to show you how it could be done. I just like cooking a little to hot and am trying to get my ducks in a row to allow that to happen.

Thanks for weighing in David. I agree with your response and it has a lot to do with my choices. I hope i won't be just throwing money away on this but have heard of good reviews on other forums.

Randy

[Chach]

completely agree with you that the 500$ is unnecessary. I am not trying to push you in to spending money you don't need to. I was just trying to show you how it could be done. I just like cooking a little to hot and am trying to get my ducks in a row to allow that to happen.

Thanks for weighing in David. I agree with your response and it has a lot to do with my choices. I hope i won't be just throwing money away on this but have heard of good reviews on other forums.

Randy

I for sure don't need help spending money I do a pretty good job with that on my own LOL. I didn't think that at all. I am very intrigued by this product and just teying to justify in my head if its actually worth doing for me. The great part is I can always take the cooking floor out and slice the floor thickness in half and put that on top later...

[JRPizza]

Randy, reading this thread leads me to two questions. What are you trying to accomplish with the very hot floor, and how confidant are you that a proprietary material will let you get where you want to go? Since we tend to put a variety to toppings on our pizzas and my wife does not like burned crusts, we usually cook our pies in the 600-700 F range. Once we move the fire to the side and keep it burning, the oven floor opposite the fire wants to stay in this range for quite a while, so it is kind of a sweet spot for our build. You said you like cooking at 800+ - are you trying to cook very thin pies very fast? I also understand in principle how a low heat transfer material could initially give up heat to the bottom crust and then more slowly transfer heat to the bottom preventing burning, but in practice how much different would this floor be than one made of fire brick? Also, do you know if the amount of heat (BTU's) a material can hold is related to thermal transfer rate, meaning will this kind of floor hold more or less heat for long term cooking vs standard fire brick?

[RandyJ]

Hey JR, thanks for stopping by to ask questions. This is what i was truly hoping for. As for what i am trying to accomplish that is a good question. I like to make pies in the neo neapolitan to neapolitan area. Most the time once my dome is clear and i am ready to start cooking my floor is in the 800 to 850 range and it can be a real challenge to keep from burning the bottom, it can be done but it is a lot of work. I love how the crust is nice and crisp and yet soft. I realize that the reason my floor is to hot is to do with how hard i fire the oven and for how long. I also want to take the VPN America training course and i have considered trying to offer some classes on making pizza in a wood fired oven. Part of the VPN rules states the oven should be around 900F. This is how i figured i could do the high heat and manage the burning of the crust.

the other issue i have is trying to always take things to the limit and beyond. My wife normally manages to stear me away from some or most of these ideas but i have a few right now that i am not letting go of.she wants a oven at the new house so i am trying to get rid of all perceived flaws and take it to the next level. I am also starting to re do my home theater system. That is where i have her worried right now. If it goes the way i am planning the power amps will be rated in Kilowatts and i am trying to decide if 2 x 24" subs is enough in a 15' x 17' room. Any sane person just shakes their head and walks away, but i am trying to decide if i will need more. That is what is truly driving this and i am just making sure i do everything i can t have the best oven i can and no idea is to far fetched to at least be considered. Thanks for the help.

Randy

[Chach]

Hey JR, thanks for stopping by to ask questions. This is what i was truly hoping for. As for what i am trying to accomplish that is a good question. I like to make pies in the neo neapolitan to neapolitan area. Most the time once my dome is clear and i am ready to start cooking my floor is in the 800 to 850 range and it can be a real challenge to keep from burning the bottom, it can be done but it is a lot of work. I love how the crust is nice and crisp and yet soft. I realize that the reason my floor is to hot is to do with how hard i fire the oven and for how long. I also want to take the VPN America training course and i have considered trying to offer some classes on making pizza in a wood fired oven. Part of the VPN rules states the oven should be around 900F. This is how i figured i could do the high heat and manage the burning of the crust.

the other issue i have is trying to always take things to the limit and beyond. My wife normally manages to stear me away from some or most of these ideas but i have a few right now that i am not letting go of.she wants a oven at the new house so i am trying to get rid of all perceived flaws and take it to the next level. I am also starting to re do my home theater system. That is where i have her worried right now. If it goes the way i am planning the power amps will be rated in Kilowatts and i am trying to decide if 2 x 24" subs is enough in a 15' x 17' room. Any sane person just shakes their head and walks away, but i am trying to decide if i will need more. That is what is truly driving this and i am just making sure i do everything i can t have the best oven i can and no idea is to far fetched to at least be considered. Thanks for the help.

Randy

Wow I didn't know there were to of us out there lol. I do the same thing and always go above what is needed. must be an IBEW thing hahahaha. My wife is always trying to talk me down amd when I agree and the project is done I wish I did what I wanted. So now I just do wjat was in my head and learned to keep it in range but go above slightly. Nothing is like finishing a project and at the end your like damn I should have just done what I was thinking. I just did this last fall when I finished the outdoor kitchen area and my fireplace is on a 45 degree from the kitchen and when it rained hard i was getting water pooling at the fireplace because I ruined the natural flow of the water runoff so what I did was I added a micro Channel drain system to Route the water out to the back of the yard I did the whole length of my outdoor kitchen and fireplace my wife was like I think you're over killing this and I was like if I don't do this and I listen to you and I get this water in front of my foundation and it sinks and creates a sinkhole or freezes and heaves im going to be very upset. yeah probably nothing will happen but I had to make sure and take that extra precautionary measure. Love her but some things we just need or want.

[RandyJ]

Hey Chach, that is pretty funny that you and i seem so similar. You are not all that far away maybe after my list of projects settles down a bit we will have to get together for a beer or pizza or both. That would be a lot of fun. In the next few weeks we will be breaking ground on a new addition to the house we just bought. So Although i have mostly of my projects almost under wraps the train is almost at the station with another huge load of things to do before I start my projects. I hope you have a wonderful day and we will talk to you later.

Randy

[Chach]

That would be fun Im sure

[rwiegand]

I just recently returned from sampling DOC pizzas at a half dozen places in Naples. I chatted up the pizzaioli but didn't explicitly ask about their temperatures, but I would say that none of them had their oven floors at 900 degrees. All of them were cooking the pizzas in 2-3 min, not 90 seconds, and none of the bottoms were burned. (and the pizzas were great!) When I get my oven floor up to 850-900 the pizzas cook in under 90 seconds, and are frequently somewhat burned, no matter how careful I am with them. I'd be careful what you wish for with a very hot floor. I'm finding I do better with just slightly cooler (around 800) and cooking for closer to 2 min. When the floor is very hot (900+) invariably the second pizza comes out much better than the first, which I attribute to the first one having absorbed the intense surface heat, alolowing the second to cook a tad more slowly without charring at first contact with the hot bricks.