caputo flour report

[dmun]

Re: caputo flour report

I'm comfortable with 65 percent. Much more and I have to use a mess of bench flour to get the dough from sticking to everything. If you have the skill to handle wetter doughs, I think you will get good results, particularly good oven spring.

[KEmerson]

Re: caputo flour report

If you have the skill to handle wetter doughs, I think you will get good results, particularly good oven spring.

I used t work at a small artisanal bakery where we made foccacia that was so wet it took me about two weeks to learn how to handle. We used food handling gloves coated in olive oil and had to keep the hands moving & forming constantly. So handling very wet dough is not so much a challenge to me. I also have no need or desire to toss dough as I figure the ability to toss must come about with a relatively dryer dough, and if wet is the aim, then dry must be the antithesis, thereby meaning that tossing (in the American sense) means something is not meeting goals.

[wlively]

Re: caputo flour report

I agree on the wetter dough. I have tried recipes from the foodtv chefs to Forno Bravo to an old Italian (1965) book. I have found that brick ovens like the wetter doughs.

[james]

Re: caputo flour report

I used t work at a small artisanal bakery where we made foccacia that was so wet it took me about two weeks to learn how to handle. We used food handling gloves coated in olive oil and had to keep the hands moving & forming constantly.

I've been making my focaccia with 90% hydration recently roughly following a Cook's Illustrated article. At that point it's barely dough; more like batter. But the focaccia comes out great. Olive oil keeps everything from sticking.

James

[KEmerson]

Re: caputo flour report

I've been making my focaccia with 90% hydration recently roughly following a Cook's Illustrated article. At that point it's barely dough; more like batter. But the focaccia comes out great. Olive oil keeps everything from sticking.

James

Yeah, with focaccia the hydration is off the charts compared with pizza. I also used quite a bit of olive oil in it. Handling it was like handling that kid's stuff, what's it called, Slime? Slippery, unmanageable, a mind of its own. I laughed almost every time I was learning just because of the dough's seeming independence. But I wasn't always laughing.

I'm gathering from what I'm reading here that to a certain extent we could say "wetter is better". I have half a mind to go ballistic once and up the % by leaps - just for kicks and experimentation. Rather than play with 63%. 63%, 65%, I'm going to head straight for... Oh I don't know yet. I just thought of this as I was typing it. 75%, why not? Has anyone tried such an experiment? There's no way this is original.

[MAVANO]

Re: caputo flour report

yes James my wife makes a great focaccia with very high hydration it turns out great she does not measure the water she adds water until the feel of the mix is right to her I always tell her to write down how much water is put in she only responds, this the way my mother taught me, but she does measure the flour 4lb.- salt 1tblsp -ady 1tblsp. mixes it in a large bowl with a spatula and pours it in a focaccia black steel 2 inch deep pan with the rippled edges that we brought back from Italy on our last visit, lets it rise for 2-3 hrs. olive oil on top (must put a little oil in pan before the mix) crushed diced tomatoes on top a little oregano -BTW the toppings are done after the rise- and bake at 450oven or WFO until the desired crispness, by the way that gtm member is very close to the amount of yeast 3 grms per 1.75k of flour, they did not specify salt or water amounts, my brother in Italy tells me he spoke to a pizzaiolo and told him that he does not use yeast in his dough but rather white wine in the biga mix ( they call it la mamma) that has not been treated with any yeast neutralizers ,( I'm guessing freshly squeezed grapes) lets it rise for 6-8 hrs. is this possible? he would not give the specifics on the amounts of ingredients very well kept secrets out there.

[james]

Re: caputo flour report

Ciao Mavano,

I think it would be great to be a master baker and have the feel to bake completely by touch -- not scale. But I'm sure not there. The more I bake the more I am getting a feel, but I have a long way to go.

For focaccia, I add EVO to the baking sheet, on top of the dough, and then more right when the bread comes out of the oven. I learned that at a WFO cooking class in Fiesole. But no EVO in the dough -- I think it retards a good oven spring.

The pizzaiolo recipe sounds like a sourdough that they are passing along. Sounds good.

La mamma reminds me of a story. There was a flier in the local market in Bagno a Ripoli, where someone was selling their entire Vin Santo making kit. Bottles, barrels, everything. Our younger daughter was translating it out loud and she said wow -- the barrels come with the mother inside! Vin Santo also has la mamma.

Salute,
James

[KEmerson]

Re: caputo flour report

The pizzaiolo recipe sounds like a sourdough that they are passing along. Sounds good.

I don't know that it qualifies as a sourdough per se, but I do a slow ferment of a simple starter, then a slow ferment of the dough itself. My starter is simply four, water, ADY, and diastatic malt which I make myself. I let this sit in my basement for at least 24-36 hrs., then set to making the dough with an autolyse of about 20-25 minutes, and another slow ferment back in the basement for another 24-36 hrs. This plus the higher hydration than I had been doing (very low back then. Now about 65%-58% w/ King Arthur AP) and a FB stone on the bottom (floor, not rack) of my gas oven cranked up to 550? F, pre-heated for about one hour has all made a huge difference to the better - way better. As James pointed out somewhere, this isn't rocket science but it takes practice, diligence and the help of a place like this. I spent years working this out on my own. I think it was Savarin who said, possibly of bechamel, that what is interesting is that all it is is milk, butter and flour but it will take a lifetime to perfect. Ok, so maybe it was Hollandaise. Not sure. Either way, damned few ingredients, fairly simple method, yet perfection does not always await.

[tombomb]

Re: caputo flour report

i agree with less water but would add use the cold water tedhniqueand try holding in frig for 24 to 48 hrs. this seems to be my best trick. some of my best doughs are up to a week old. note i do not use any oil. be well