Crust issues

[Tscarborough]

Re: Crust issues

I can throw a dough, but as a rule, I just push it out leaving 1/4" of the edge strictly alone. It helps to leave the center a little thicker, but I end up pounding the crust pretty good by the end. My pies are not big or many, 14" max, usually 12", but if I was doing more or bigger pies, I would throw them.

[bobframe]

Re: Crust issues

Yeah, I figured out that a rolling pin would tend to inhibit the development of bubbles in the crust (Right?). So my last pie was done purely by hand. Now, my technique really blows...but I am trying to be patient and still properly aggressive in stretching the dough out to the thickness and diameter that suits me. Needs work here!!!

I suspect that getting the dough to just the right consistency/degree of wetness has something to do with how "workable" the dough is. Yes? Again, needs work here.

Would I be accomplishing the same thing as you do by using the stone counter tops instead of a metal or plastic tray?

Actually, my ego is very much in check and I am drinking in all the advice I can. At some point I will think I've become an expert and will not listen to anything...but thats a ways off.

[Dino_Pizza]

Re: Crust issues

Bob,
I don't use a rolling pin. Actually, very few on this forum use a pin. I use either caputo or bread-flour on the back of my hands and knuckles and gently turn it over back and forth while I gently stretch it round. I use a plastic tray or large round metal pizza tray to flop it on (well floured) and usually add a little hand pulling and tugging on the flat tray. I use a tray or pizza pan so not to get flour all over the counter-floor-roof rafters...it ain't pretty.

Jay will have to explain it to you (he's much better at this) because I think "balling" early and "relaxing" all have to do with the suppleness of the dough and then how easy it becomes to hand stretch (not compressed with a rolling pin).

I get the rice flour at any ethnic store (Persian, middle eastern, asian and larger markets always carry it and it's cheap). And no, the rice flour is only shaken onto the 'placing peel', you hand-stretch (or roll-if you insist) with flour.

OK, maybe now you're not so happy with all this advice.

Actually, thank you, I'm getting lots of good info too -Dino

[dmun]

Re: Crust issues

Pizza screen images

[bobframe]

Re: Crust issues

Biggest caveat is to ball it early. The bread flour needs to relax before you form pies. Longer the better.

Jay, I appreciate the advice, but I don't understand this part of what you offered. Can you explain this please?

Thanks so much.

Bob

[bobframe]

Re: Crust issues

So Dino, what do you use on your counter to prevent the dough from sticking while you work it into shape? I assumed I needed flour to keep it from sticking to the granite...but maybe not?

Where does one find rice flour? Can you use rice flour to roll out the dough?

[Dino_Pizza]

Re: Crust issues

Hey Bob, your pizza's look quite nice. Aren't you glad you moved over to this thread and got much better advice than mine on the original? You've got people all over the country ready to re-calibrate your Wolf oven for you .

MY favorite release is rice flour shaken out of a large salt shaker with a handle. Rice is so hard and repels water (wheat cooks in seconds, rice cooks in 45 minutes) that a little works terrific to slide the pie off the paddle.

Seriously, nice looking pies. I love that Reinhart 'America Pie' book. BrianShaws got good advice. Can't wait to get more details on his 'screen'.

Cheers, Dino

[bobframe]

Re: Crust issues

Nice looking Pie, Bob. My mouth started watering!

Aside from using the absolute minimum amount of flour on the board, and "lubricating" the paddle with corn meal or semolina or rice flour (everyone seems to have their favorite)... the approach I often take is the use of a screen. I throw the dough and land it on an appropriately sized screen befroe suacing, topping ad baking. After a couple of minutes the skin has set enough to slide a peel between the screen and pie. The screen comes out and the pie goes directly on the stone. This is one way to minimize the amount of flour, etc on the bottom of the pizza.

Brian,

I am interested in this "screen" approach. Can you describe the screen in more detail? Pictures?

Thanks a bunch.

[BrianShaw]

Re: Crust issues

Nice looking Pie, Bob. My mouth started watering!

Aside from using the absolute minimum amount of flour on the board, and "lubricating" the paddle with corn meal or semolina or rice flour (everyone seems to have their favorite)... the approach I often take is the use of a screen. I throw the dough and land it on an appropriately sized screen befroe suacing, topping ad baking. After a couple of minutes the skin has set enough to slide a peel between the screen and pie. The screen comes out and the pie goes directly on the stone. This is one way to minimize the amount of flour, etc on the bottom of the pizza.

[texassourdough]

Re: Crust issues

I second Brian! The NeoNeoplolitan is easier to handle and well behaved which can be helpful to newbies. Biggest caveat is to ball it early. The bread flour needs to relax before you form pies. Longer the better.

550 is great. But give it an hour to get the stone to temp. You will have to experiement with convection on/off to see which works better for the pies. Convection will heat the stone faster but for pies it may or may not balance well between the rate the top and bottom cooks.

Good Luck!
Jay

[bobframe]

Re: Crust issues

One more issue:

I find that the crust bottom has a lot of uncooked flour on it- obviously a by product of rolling the dough on a floured surface. Tried to brush it all off, but I guess I'm unable to get it all. Also, sliding the dough onto a floured peel seems to add flour.

Am I being fussy or am I missing a step here?

Thanks in advance for all your help.

[bobframe]

Re: Crust issues

One more of the bottom:

[bobframe]

Re: Crust issues

OK...lunch is over and here's the results.

I had a dough ball left over from a couple of days ago in the frig and decided to make it for lunch. I set oven on Convection Bake/550F and let it warm my stone for 75 minutes on the middle rack. The dough sat out on the counter for 2 hours.

The results were good..better than before. I would rate the crust 7/10...not good enough to win the gold, but pretty darn tasty. The crust was definitely crisper and more browned than before- so this is progress.

Here's what I ate:

[splatgirl]

Re: Crust issues

You'd be able to see the upper element cycling on if you kept an eye on it during baking. Unfortunately I am all too familiar with crappy manufacturer service on a range that costs almost as much as a small car. I've gotten better service and support on a $25 blender than on any of my high end appliances.

FWIW, I found that I didn't like using convection mode for pizzas in my indoor oven, but I think that just like WFO pizza cookery, it just takes experimentation and practice to find what works best for you.

[BrianShaw]

Re: Crust issues

Talked to my oven manufacturer (Wolf). They were not particularly helpful in deciphering what burners operate in what mode. I'm going to try Bake Convection next time and will crank this thing all the way (550- I think).

That's a real shame that Wolf isn't being informative. What's the secret, after all, that they can't share with their customers and users??? That kind of thing drives me nuts!

Suggest pre-heat with convection, but during bake keep a careful eye that toppings don't cook faster than the crust because of the convection. I assume Wolf give you the ability to turn the convection off if you don't want/need it.