My sourdough attempt

[Gulf]

Re: My sourdough attempt

Serf,
I use a cast iron cloche covered for 20 minutes and finish the loaf uncovered, and this baking is done in my kitchen oven. The recipe will work fine in the WFO just remember to add steam to the bake to develop the crust.

Chris

Thanks, for the recipe Chris.
I couldn't help but catch the "cast iron cloche" in your reply. When I google this, the hits are usually "clay cloches" or "cloches vrs. dutch ovens". I only have three cast iron dutch ovens to work with. Will they work as well?

[SCChris]

Re: My sourdough attempt

Thanks, for the recipe Chris.
I couldn't help but catch the "cast iron cloche" in your reply. When I google this, the hits are usually "clay cloches" or "cloches vrs. dutch ovens". I only have three cast iron dutch ovens to work with. Will they work as well?

I used the term "cloche" because in my mind, iron or clay seem to serve the same purpose. Your cast iron dutch ovens should be fine as long as it can contain a reasonable amount of steam, and it should. here is what I'm using for my boules up to about 900G.

Lodge L8DD3 Double Dutch Oven and Casserole with Skillet Cover, 5-Quart : Amazon.com : Kitchen & Dining

I'm using a very large stainless steel bowl for my really big loaves up to 3kg. I haven't tried the bowl in the WFO, but I can't believe that it wouldn't help with crust formation. Of course what I really need is Faith's super steamer..

Chris

[GianniFocaccia]

Re: My sourdough attempt

I only have three cast iron dutch ovens to work with. Will they work as well?

Gulf,

Night before last I baked two loaves of sourdough applying SCChris' dough prep using a KA Artisan flour he gave me, and a slightly modified recipe to the one he listed above.

One loaf I baked in my cast iron dutch oven, a second loaf I baked in my clay cloche. I baked them at the same time and temp (475F). The results were nearly identical, save for a slightly burnt bottom on the cast iron loaf, which was easily attributed to the seasoning oil I had mistakenly neglected to wipe out of the pan prior to baking.

You can find pics of the loaves here:

http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f11/...ugh-20235.html

I say the cast iron is fine.

John

[bing]

Re: My sourdough attempt

o.k. thanks. is levain is same as "biga"?

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: My sourdough attempt

they are the same in respect to they are both preferments but different in the respect that levian's are a wild yeast that reproduces (that's why you need to feed an care for it) while a bigga or poolish and other names are made with a commercial yeast that dies off comparatively quickly.

Faith

[GrahamG]

Re: My sourdough attempt

swab and bake.
I have used ice cubes instead of water for a prolonged steam. But I'm working on a steam injection system for my WFO. Need that steam!!!

A stupid question (second time in cooking bread on WFO!), how do you get the hot ask out?? Shovel?? Into a steel box?

Fab sourdough!

[GianniFocaccia]

Re: My sourdough attempt

how do you get the hot ask out?? Shovel?? Into a steel box?

Sorry, haven't got there yet! (the bread was cooked in the gas house oven)

The recommended procedure is to remove hot coals/ash with a rake/shovel and then close the oven up so it can equalize and come to proper temp.

I'm guessing this job would be expedited with a wide, lightweight shovel and a good-sized galvanized bucket for the coals.

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: My sourdough attempt

I have two ways to remove coals, both require a hoe or rake. The hoe like a garden hoe pulls all the coals from the back and sides of the oven out to the entrance. From there I use a metal dust pan (no plastic parts) found a large one at the hardware store. Then dump in to a metal trash can.

I also made a removable ash dump (difficult to explain) but it is a metal catch that I place up to the front of the oven. Then I hoe the coals right out of the oven into the coal catch. (like a rectangle trash can the width of my opening)

But in the end do what ever works for you. Just don't burn yourself or have your ash bucket catch a surrounding item on fire.

There is a thread here about showing off your tools that will give you a good idea of what people are using.

[bing]

Re: My sourdough attempt

Serf,
Try this one for simple;
By weight
1 part levain
2 parts water
3 parts flour
add 1% salt of the total dough weight, the total weight of the levain, water and flour.

Mix the water and the levain,
mix the flour and salt,
mix the wet and the dry until all of the dry is moistened,
Autolyse for 90 minutes
Stretch and fold aggressive enough to form a dough ball
Stretch and fold twice more at 30 minute intervals
pre shape at 3 hours after the start of the autolyse
Shape 30 minutes later
bake in 2 to 3 hours or when the dough is ready.
Pre-heat the oven to 500F and lower the temp to 450F when the bread goes into the oven. I use a cast iron cloche covered for 20 minutes and finish the loaf uncovered, and this baking is done in my kitchen oven. The recipe will work fine in the WFO just remember to add steam to the bake to develop the crust.

Chris

I make my levain (starter) . My question is if i want to make dough from 10 kg flour , how to make 1 part of levian becouse i have a small amount of levain. Can i night before mix levain and part of flour to rise and next morning mix that part with flour and water and let bulk rise??





I make my levain (starter). My question is if i want to make dough from 10 kg dr

[SCChris]

Re: My sourdough attempt

Your going to need to build your levain to 3333g or 3.33Kg.

My apologies for the following wordiness, and I hope you get it the first time, but ask and we'll get you going.

Not calculating the flour needed for the levain coming from the 10Kg of flour;
The final dough will require the following;
3,333 g of Levain
6,667 g (6.67 Liters) of water
10,000g (10Kg) of flour

For simplicity sake a 240g levain build will include, this can vary by personal preference by hydration or the volume of starter, but to keep it simple.
First build =
40g of starter
100g of water
100g of flour

Second build, if we use all of this 240g in the next build the levain grows to 1440g
240g of starter
600g of water
600g of flour
If we use all of this 1440g in the next build the levain grows to 8640g, well past what you need.

If you adjust the amounts in the second build to;
92.6g of starter
231.5g of water
231.5g of flour
Your yield is 555.5 grams

The next build would be
555.5g starter from the above
1389g of water
1389g of flour

Your yield is now just at 3333g of levain, just what you need to meet the 1-2-3

Your total dough yield is 20Kg and the salt required is 200g.

Each build will take about 8-12 hours depending on the temperature, so it's going to be a couple of days before you have what you need.

Please ask questions if your not clear.

Sincerely

Chris

PS A point that needs making is that there is great variance in how bakers hydrate the starter and the levain and these change to adjust for environmental temperatures and how long the baker wishes the build to take. Up to a point, the higher the hydration, the higher the temperatures, the faster the build will go.

Bakers starter hydrations, that I'm aware of, range from 65% up to 100% hydration, and these are personal choices rather than bound by hard and fast rules. Some believe that lower hydrations maintain flavors that wouldn't be retained at higher hydrations, I haven't decided and keep my starter at 80% hydration and vary the amount of "seed" starter used to maintain my starter. More in winter, less in summer.

There are no rules that I'm aware of to define the right amount of hydration, so it would be just as correct to use the 1-2-3 formula to maintain your starter and build your levain, and this could be correctly described as using the "old dough" method to maintain your SD culture and build your bread.. If you decided that this is what you prefer to do, make sure that the salt is always added to the bread dough after removing the starter portion to be saved for the next build and bake.

Old dough is also used with commercial yeast baking to add flavor to the bread that isn't available without retarding the dough or using old dough.

[SCChris]

Re: My sourdough attempt

I'm including link to some SD predictive work done on another site, pizzamaking.com. In short you'll find some charts and graphs that indicate SD "starter" growth observations using varying temperatures and starter seed amounts. I've included the link because on my first review of the information, it seems consistent with what I and others, those commenting in the thread, see in the real world and the scientific research reference.

Sourdough starter quantity predictive model

Chris

[bing]

Re: My sourdough attempt

thanks, i make my sourdough bread before reading your post. so i make 1/3 levain from starter and not wait to double every time to get enough weight (for 1/3 ). i put smal amount of starter and 1 kg flour and water night before i plan to baking. it is doubled in size next day and i mix it with flour and wather for planing weight of final dough (formula 1-2-3). dough wont rise this day(second) fast and i left doug to rise to the evenindg when it is doubled after 14 hours (it was about 10 oclock in the evening). so i divide dough at the basket and left over night. next morning i bake at 7 oclock. dough is looking great and it is doubled again. but in the oven the dough wont rise. the bread was flat, and the temperature was good( 260 C). taste of bread is good too. next time will be better. sorry for english.