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Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

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  • shuboyje
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    But a sphere section creates a circle, and if designed right that circle can cover almost the entire oven floor. Now mind you none of this actually matters because our rough matt yellowish fire bricks are not prefect emitters, and they do not produce perfect straight waves of radiation, they create diffused radiation like the sun on a cloudy day. If they did produce perfect radiation which oven would cook more even? Obviously the low dome oven with it's heat focused evenly over almost the entire oven floor. The hemisphere has many advantages as it is easier to build and more stable on top of the fact that the design has been proven many times over in great functioning ovens, but the even heat from a single point idea that gets thrown around here is nonsense. If that was the case you would have one hot spot in your oven and the rest would lose heat rapidly. The fact that doesn't happen shows the radiation in our ovens is highly diffused.

    Originally posted by Neil2 View Post
    A hemisphere focuses the heat at one point. An ellipse at two points, or in the case of an oven in a ring.

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  • dsgreco
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    I have seen a few of those threaded rod, adjustable tools in use here. They seem to work. Have you calculated how much adjustment is needed on the tool for each course or are you following a template as a guide to make these adjustments?
    I am following a template.

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  • Neil2
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    A hemisphere focuses the heat at one point. An ellipse at two points, or in the case of an oven in a ring.

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  • 100million
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    My oven is 14 " height on inside dome and 29 wide

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  • fxpose
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    Originally posted by dsgreco View Post
    I am building a lower dome 36" oven. My diameter is 36" but my final interior height will be 15.5". I have made an indespensible tool that has an adjustment for length and I had to bend the end as well. I am working on the second course now and it seems to be working out ok. As I get into the upper courses we will see if the design works.
    Hi,
    I have seen a few of those threaded rod, adjustable tools in use here. They seem to work. Have you calculated how much adjustment is needed on the tool for each course or are you following a template as a guide to make these adjustments?

    Leave a comment:


  • dsgreco
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    I am building a lower dome 36" oven. My diameter is 36" but my final interior height will be 15.5". I have made an indespensible tool that has an adjustment for length and I had to bend the end as well. I am working on the second course now and it seems to be working out ok. As I get into the upper courses we will see if the design works.

    Leave a comment:


  • david s
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    I'm an art teacher and we now have to keep a register for PD (30 Hrs/year)otherwise we can be de-registered. I think I will tell them to stick it and keep all my gallery receipts. That should be sufficient. After Italy in October we travel through Switzerland by rail to Provance, France for self guided cycle tour through all the van Gogh country then on to Loire valley for a week, Then on to UK and Ireland by car, return to the tropical heat of Townsville for early Dec. I'm excited!

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  • Muscats
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    you lucky bugger, make sure you bring back plenty of authentic reciepts

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  • david s
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    I agree entirely, however some folk like the vertical sides at the base, so it gives them more room at the edges. Personally I like the traditional hemisphere, it served the aancient Romans well for thousands of years, that's good enough for me and I like knowing I'm part of a long tradition. My wife and I are visiting Italy in October and amongst other things, I'm excited about visiting Pompei.

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  • Muscats
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    david s;

    yes, I agree about the hemisphere being more perfect, and if you follow the arguments re heating and radiated heat the perfect hemisphere is supposed to do the best job by heating more evenly and radiating in all directions.
    That is why I thought the idea of lowering the focus of the sphere would achieve three aims. It would keep the nice hemispherical shape I wanted, and keep the top of the dome reasonably low, while still providing a 42" floor.

    Paul

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  • david s
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    Remember too that the most efficient combustion chamber is the hemisphere. Any departure from it is a compromise. It's like boats, there is no perfect form. The form you choose is a compromise to suit your needs.

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  • dmun
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    Muscat's idea of a radius beneath the floor will work to create a sphere segment, but if you want a truly elliptical dome, the bricks will not point to a single point. If you try with a variable length indispensable tool, you'll end up with stepped courses, although it may be too subtle to make a difference. I've tried to wrap my head around a double jointed tool that would mimic the focii of an ellipse, but the problem eludes me at the moment.

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  • 100million
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    Paul look at my build I have low ceiling for pizza oven

    All I used to set the height of the bricks for each row is A piece of sheet rock

    What we did is this

    We draw found the height we wanted and then draw the shape of half of the dome on a table....A cross cut section of it ....This allowed us to find each angle of each row before we started making the rows.... Then what we did is cut one stone for each row and placed it on the table .....then what we did is this we took a piece of sheet rock and carved the exact shape of the doom and then we mark ever angle and height of each row on the sheet rock.... then after we made the 1st solider row we had a mark of how high the next row and what angle it needed to be.....It is not rocket science to keep the cut bricks in place with the 1/4 shape of the doom ( piece of sheet rock ).

    If you have any question about this just ask it was easy and if you look at the inside of our doom it is SWEET and as perfect as a imperfect man can do.

    I know there are perfect women out there but that is another story

    http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f8/b...oor-12363.html

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  • david s
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    Another solution is to simply build a sand castle of the required form over the floor and lay the bricks up to the sand. when done you dig the sand out the door. Shaping the form is actually quite easy and with some taps of the flat of a trowel you can get it smooth and accurate. I read somewhere that 10% water (by volume) is about the correct mixture.

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  • shuboyje
    replied
    Re: Neapolitan oven - lower dome height

    To me that seems like extra work and potential for a uneven floor without any real gain. IMHO a slightly lower hemispherical dome doesn't sound like what you are after. If you want more of a naples style oven you need a tall soldier course and a very flat roof. If you don't want to go to that extent and deal with the issues it creates(Indispensable Tool doesn't really work, need to support the lateral force of the dome on the soldier course, etc.)then you are probably best off following the beaten path. For reference my oven is a tiny 30" with a 7.5 inch soldier course and a 13.5 inch dome height. I am currently planning a bigger oven and will go even lower with a 48" oven having a 10 inch soldier and a 14" dome height. None of this leads to a true Naples shaped oven, you aren't gonna find that info online, but it would get you closer then what you've proposed.

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