Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

[mikku]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

Any frost heaving "will not lift the entire pad" if the pad is below frost line.
the frost acts on the posts, which will pop out of the ground like squeezed pimples if they are not anchored!

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

.............

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

............

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

..........

End of message.

[mikku]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

Unruffle your feathers,
I do not recommend wooden posts in the ground at all! Read the entire post, i said sonotube with a lower base! So what about this do you disagree with? I don't like pole structures and that is where your expertise might be. Better to let this NY person do his build however he wants to do it! My main point is " why the heck would any person in their right mind- build a masonry structure (of any type) on top of 4 treated posts? Can you in all sincerity- rationalize that is a correct way to do things?

If you get pissed off so easily, should try a different vocation! Building is all about "customer is always right!" not how many certificates you got on your walls! anyway..lots of bull headed guys in this business! See we have something in common!

[mikku]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

I am speaking to a forum, not to anyone in particular except for the person from Rockland County.

If someone, who addressed me personally does not like what I say that is fine.
If he wants to take it up with FB, do your best!

If I am banned..so what! Is this another level of achievement? Being able to use a forum... should we all fall down and worship your licenses?

I am giving this Rockland County individual advice on what I have experienced in extreme cold weather climates. It is his choice to accept what is freely given or not!

[Tscarborough]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

In construction in particular, the customer is not always right. They may know what they want, but that does not mean they know how to accomplish that end.

[mikku]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

I think what you fail to understand is. You dig your pad below the frost line, build your wooden base, adjust your base on top of the pads to the proper location. THEN fill the rest of the hole with concrete to within a few inches of ground level. So the frost CAN'T even get in any contact with the wooden post. So if you think frost will pop the post out of the concrete sleeve...I don't think so.

I hope that helps you understand.

So, the frost doesn't act against the concrete that you poured into the hole?
they are all stuck together! What don't you see?

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

................

[mikku]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

In construction in particular, the customer is not always right. They may know what they want, but that does not mean they know how to accomplish that end.

The customer always being right - phrase refers to they ultimately hold the purse string. You can argue till you are blue in the face, the customer may threaten to take a case to court, or whatever. If you can satisfy your customer by doing quality work to their expectation. You will get "paid" and that is the KEY word in staying in business... Keep your customers happy, collect your money, build a good reputation--and reap the rewards of building nice things and using your imagination and skills! And part of doing a good job is "exceeding building requirements" in doing better that what is "minimally required" so that you do not get troubling call backs! The call backs are what kill you. A little 50cent job can cost thousands of dollars just to send in a crew to do some little stinky thing that you should have done right in the first place!

[mikku]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

O.K. In your area you are a respected builder.
What I keep saying is! The post and the concrete surrounding the post will pop out of the ground together if the base below is not attached.

If you dig a hole...
Pour a small base...
later insert a sonotube form and fill with concrete
this concrete sonotube base will pop out of the ground!

If you stick some rebar in the hole when you pour the base--some with L's bent, then place the sonotube form over the rebar and fill the form with concrete... once this sets properly--frost will not pop this out "if the lower base is below frost line!

That is the only point I am making.

I found it very easy--in years past when wanting to do small additions utilizing sonotube bases, to first form (as an example) a 30"x30" x12" box; made from treated lumber-put a piece of treated plywood on top to make a cover; cut a hole in the cover to insert a 12" sonotube. Now use a backhoe---dig holes where support is required--set these combined forms into the holes in proper alignment, insert rebar with 12" L's bent into the sonotube ( maybe 3, 4, 5) then backfill the holes and pour concrete. What you end up is a monolithic pour, the base and sonotube being one casting. If the base is below frost line, it is virtually impossible for frost to work on these posts. Further, you leave the sonotube in the ground--cardboard cut off somewhere below GL and call it good. Some areas do not like formwork left in the ground--but ground contact treated should be OK for any inspector worth his salt!

wakarimushitaka (meaning) do you follow what I am saying?

As far as the rockland county WFO builder is concerned, I said--dig one big hole, pour a slab with rebar sticking out where support is required, later place sonotube forms over these rebar at proper location; backfill and pour. A great never worry about base for a WFO.

Now I'm getting a little tired, 4 hours and have to kick it in the ass again at work! good luck on your build rockland county NY mate!

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

............

[Faith In Virginia]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

...........

[mikku]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

I'm going to bed---but please tell me "why" there are minimum foundation depths for frost footings? What is the thinking that produced these codes?

Do a little research on how frost acts in the ground or better how ice forms in the ground. There are a lot of foundation designs that do not place footers below frost line--example: in perma frost areas. Also check into the use of insulation materials to disrupt the pattern of frost formation. I doubt any of this is in any license testing.. usually the "why" is missing.

I don't know how this is going to help Mr. Rockland county--but it gets the juices flowing anyway! If he paints his posts black, keeps the oven in a nice sunny place, keeps a decent ground cover during winter months---probably won't get much frost.. Better yet, use the oven during winter months and throw a tarp over it when not in use---ground will probably never freeze!

[mikku]

Re: Rockland County, NY 36" build with pictures.

I always thought that mountains were formed by the movement of tectonic plates --a related way would be by volcanic action. The wearing down of mountains caused by water that freezes in cracks in stone, the ice expanding, thus splitting the rock, the rain comes and washes the pieces away, other geographic features caused by the movement of huge sheets of ice---originally as they moved across continents, the shear weight of the ice and its forward movement gouged out huge features like the great lakes, receeding actions left deposits of stone and gravel otherwise not local to a particular area.

Anyway, ready to kick off another beautiful day...only have to worry about earthquakes or some flying heavenly object that has not yet been spotted to zoom out of the sky and wipe us out....or a ranting idiot in NKOREA who wants to nuke us! Hope ya all have a nice one!