It's time to go Vertical

[RCLake]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

I'd have to place mine in the rustic category.

Either or, but if I had a do-over I would have bought the HF saw, and tapered for a nice tight fit!

My 2 pennies!

Dave

I do have to agree, I started with my 7" wet saw and my miter saw, which worked ok but I took out the gears in the wet saw (lot of prior work). I got the 10" and it has really made things easier.

[RCLake]

Re: Bevel cuts necessary or not

RC, I've been watching your progress and am amazed. This is my 2nd post here ever so I'm quite new at this but it sure will help me build my 42" pompeii this spring. I have a few questions if you don't mind:

1)The FB downloadable free Pompeii plans don't really show beveling or tapering cuts. Are you doing this to reduce how much pricey Refmix is used?

2)Do I need to keep all the mortar joints at 3/8" or can they be as large as the 42" wide, 20" high dome naturally gives on the outside of the oven?

3) Is beveling recommended to keep as much mortar out of the design as practical?

I know I'll be making lots of interesting cuts at the keystone and arch but I'm curious about avoiding (yes, I'm scared really) of making tapered cuts.

Thanks, Dino

FOR SURE AND FOR CERTAIN read the advice offered on this forum and you won't go wrong. James has offered a tremendous place to convince everyone that they also can do this, including me.
To answer your questions all at once. I've done the bevel and angle cuts on the sides of the bricks to reduce the amount of mortar and also stay in the manufactures 3/8" limit. Another reason I felt good about, this should make each ring lock itself together for support. I use the word taper to describe when I cut the bottom of the brick at an angle - I've done this so I haven't had to raise the back of the brick up to much when I'm trying to get to a 20" ceiling height. Look at Acoma's thread and he has a tremendous build going on. He has used a larger gap initially and did question it during row 6. When he started to remove that row he found that the mortar had really set and decided to go on. I'm not that confident in the Heat Stop 50 I've been using so I'm thinking that RefMix may be a better mortar, though I haven't used it. If shipping wasn't such a factor I would have order it versus buying locally.

If you are getting a wet saw (10") you will find out that cutting these bricks at angles aren't scary at all. It's not like a wood saw at all, more like a grinder. Still be very careful - it is a motorized tool. Cutting the bevels through row 11 wasn't difficult at all, the last two rows being smaller bricks were interesting.

Be confident that you will be able to do all of this. So far the hardest physical part was pouring the hearth. The rest has been extreme enjoyment
Good Luck

[asudavew]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

I think that is one of the reasons why a slightly more rustic oven will cook and last as well as a perfectly tight dome.

James

I'd have to place mine in the rustic category.

And I do have problems with cracks.
but I think it is mainly do to the fact that the slab(the stand is on), sank a bit.

Causing a stress fracture.

Either or, but if I had a do-over I would have bought the HF saw, and tapered for a nice tight fit!

My 2 pennies!

Dave

[james]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

You can make the inside joints that face into the oven very tight, while the outer joints -- that you do not see, and that is never exposed to direct fire -- are wider. I think that is one of the reasons why a slightly more rustic oven will cook and last as well as a perfectly tight dome.

James

[jet]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

Dino,

I'm glad you asked about the tapering, because I had the same question!

I know that the tapering is not required to make a working oven, but I would think that, in general, a smaller mortar joint is better than a bigger one, no? For example, I would think that a 1.5 inch gap would not be desireable. Is there a recommended maximum or minimum gap size?

Thanks.

Jet

[Inishta]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

Dino, I've got to say that dmun has it exactly right. Your oven is such a personal thing that it really doesnt matter which system you follow as long as the end result does exactly what you wanted it to. Enjoy the process......Take from the advice on the forum (and that is immense) what suits your needs and have a great time with the build.

[dmun]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

Low duty fire brick cuts really easily on a 10 inch wet saw. Once you've sprung for the saw, it's easy to get carried away. It's fun, and it looks great.

This said, none of this is necessary. The original plans called for bricks broken in half with a brick set, and the fireclay-sand-portland mortar. The door arch was established with angle irons. These ovens are crude, but they work fine.

There is a little bit of show-offishness in the most closely fitted ovens. Do they use less mortar? Yes. Is it important? Not very.

I suppose the main thing is that most of us will only build one oven, and we want it to be as good as possible. That doesn't mean that's the only way to do it.

Good luck with your project.

[Frances]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

Yep, what he said.

The ovens with every stone cut exactly to shape to form perfect dome get a lot of attention (and rightly so), but ovens with less cuts bake just as well in the end.

[gjbingham]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

Dino,
Lots of ways to accomplish your oven. Keep looking through the forum. Many, many are done without all the complicated cuts.

[Dino_Pizza]

Bevel cuts necessary or not

RC, I've been watching your progress and am amazed. This is my 2nd post here ever so I'm quite new at this but it sure will help me build my 42" pompeii this spring. I have a few questions if you don't mind:

1)The FB downloadable free Pompeii plans don't really show beveling or tapering cuts. Are you doing this to reduce how much pricey Refmix is used?

2)Do I need to keep all the mortar joints at 3/8" or can they be as large as the 42" wide, 20" high dome naturally gives on the outside of the oven?

3) Is beveling recommended to keep as much mortar out of the design as practical?

I know I'll be making lots of interesting cuts at the keystone and arch but I'm curious about avoiding (yes, I'm scared really) of making tapered cuts.

Thanks, Dino

[RCLake]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

I thought about it overnight and I'm in agreement with you three fine gentlemen. I have the weekend committed in Dallas and will start the arch next week. I'll spend some time today cleaning up and deciding who's ideas I want to copy.

[gjbingham]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

RC,
I did what you are suggesting, just because I was worried about freezing weather affecting the dome mortar before I got the entryway done2. I did recure the arch with another set of fires. I don't see that it matters one way or another.
From my own observations, the arch does not get nearly as hot as the oven, even at full heat. That is by touch test on the outside of the bricks of the arch. You'd guess that at least the portion of the arch closest to the dome where all the hot air comes pouring out would be darn near the same temps as the dome. It only feels warm to the touch. I say, do whatever you want, but be prepared for big black ugly smoke marks on your bricks.

[Acoma]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

RC, Dave is right. Finish the arch first. You are there, so don't shortcut the process now. Let's say you cured before the arch was done, started having fun, then decided to do the arch? I believe you will just rush the arch to say "done and whatever!". Don't go that route.

[asudavew]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

It does take some pondering.

But you are right.
You could cure and cook then add the entry... but then you would have to cure again.

The entry really doesn't take that long to build.

I bet you could do it in a day.. two at most.
Go fer it!!

[RCLake]

Re: It's time to go Vertical

Question, I haven't finished the arch as you can see and I thought that once the keystone is in I'd leave it alone for a week and then start the curing fires. At a later time I'd finish the arch. My thinking today is that I'd have to do the curing process all over. I was thinking that I could start cooking even without a vent/arch but right now I'm not sure that is wise.

I think I know how I'll do the arch but really haven't given any thought to the chimney. I guess I'll ponder that over a cold one.