FB Pompeii Oven Kit

[CSWolffe]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

My question, will the kit come with a UL rating?
Im looking into opening a small pizzeria here in Salt Lake, and the building department is difficult to work with. They wont allow a Pompeii 'do it yourselfer' without a rating. It has to be a 'manufactured' oven with specs from the factory. I just cant afford even the Ristorante 110, unless I give up work tables, mixer, and seats for my customers....

[Ken524]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

There is no way UL can give a rating to a pallet of bricks, mortar and insulation. The Pompeii "kit" is as un-assembled as you can get; raw materials.

If you want to do a pizza restaurant and need a UL rated oven, you really should go with one of FB's UL commercial ovens. Perhaps a small business loan?

[james]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

CSWolffe,
That's a tough one. I don't understand your building department not accepting a site built oven -- there certainly are others around the country. I would go back and ask them what their issues are; after all, UL is dedicated to the cause of building and product safety -- not eliminating certain classes of product. You can build a safe site-made oven.

Go get 'em.
James

[Ken524]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

James,

After seeing your post and giving it some thought, shouldn't it be like any building-code project? Present detailed plans and get inspections along the way?

[CSWolffe]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

That is my plan. Initial conversation with a building inspector indicated I would have a difficult time getting a site built oven approved, without a Ansi/UL rating. The problem is not just safety, they will approve a brick fireplace, the problem is that it will be used to serve food. Building department does not want to ok the oven unless the health department will, and the health department does not want to give permission unless the building department does. I was hoping an ANSI/UL rating for the Pompeii kit could cut out a great deal of headache.
Im still a ways away from building, Im in the process of writing out my business plan for a loan and or grant, so I have time to investigate. I like to be thorough.
And now, to get the thread back on track... Yes, I might buy the kit for my home use. Footing and support are under construction, so there is still time for me to order the kit or buy the supplies myself.

[james]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

Food safety is a different kettle of fish. We also have NSF/ANSI-4 certification for our ovens -- which is where they test to make sure we aren't going to poison anyone, use lead products, or have a place where bacteria can build up.

Don't forget that pizza ovens get hot enough to where no bacteria can live through it -- so with some planning, you should be able to get your local food health department to OK your oven as well.

One last item. You will have to prove that your venting system passes building safety as well. There are two ways to do that. The easiest is to just buy a UL103HT chimney system, such as DuraVent -- which we use with our commercial ovens. The other option is to build a masonry chimney, with proper set backs from combustibles. There are instructions for that in the FB manuals.

Good luck.
James

[SCChris]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

Thanks James,
The price is right. Now if I can find a compound wet miter saw, that can make the cuts. My bet is that the saw will be more than the kit, after tax and shipping. That said, the tools can make the project flow faster and the end result a tighter oven.

Chris

[blacknoir]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

Are the floor tiles basically just large firebricks?

[james]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

Hey blacknoir,

Exactly. The floor tiles are the exact same stuff as the firebricks (composition and density), and they are 12"x12", rather than 9"x4.5". Fewer seams is really cool; very nice.

Often you see floor tiles like this at a a really high price (I think their logic is that floor tiles are made in lower volumes) which makes them unpractical. We are able to buy the floor tiles at a really reasonable price. They cost more by surface area than the firebricks, but not a huge amount more.
James

[blacknoir]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

Are there any kits available now or do we get put on a waiting list?

[mluttropp]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

James

I was looking around the FB store and found a link to the Pompeii Oven kit 110 and saw the it was priced at $1,000. This was quite a bit higher than you were shooting for but perhaps worth it. What really shocked me was the $780 to ship it to me in Northern California vs the original target price of $100. I hope I don't have to start shopping for all of these components but at a total price near $1,800 for the kit I may not have a choice. Is it possible to pick up a kit vs having it delivered?

[eprante]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

James,
As a new member of the forum, I have a question for you. I am spending more time than is probably reasonable looking at all the build threads that I can and learning about the different approaches that builders have taken. It seems to me that there seem to be two major camps. The "artisan, meticulous, engineering types, who make several cuts to each brick; these builders not only want to build an oven but a beautiful piece of craftmanship. Ironically all of their work is ultimately covered up.

The second group seems to be of the mind that the fewer cuts on brick that are made the faster the oven will go together ("people who thought the earth was flat have been doing this for thousands of years" , plus they didn't have 10" diamond wet saws. Their brickwork is less elegant but again gets covered up and only the bread and pizza see the final work.
So, have you had experience with any of these ovens failing when fire has been introduced and what are the factors that would cause such failure. This project seems to be enough work that it is worth doing right, it just seems that there are several interpretations of what is right. Please enlighten me
Eric

[EADavis]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

I am having to agree with mluttropp, the shipping costs may make this a deal breaker. Too bad, at the original $100 target cost for CA, this would be a great deal (too good to be true, I am afraid to say). It is interesting, the Pompeii 90 kit costs $616 to ship 150 miles down Hwy 101, but $968 to ship it 3000 miles to CT. It actually would cost $150 less to ship the Pompeii 110 to CA if you ordered the FB Mortar, Blanket and Board separately and mailed the bricks in 34 USPS Large Flat Rate boxes ($13.50 a box, up to 70 lbs each) - but your mailman would definitely go "postal" if he had to deliver almost 1,700 lbs of brick! One other quirk I found looking at the component shipping data - the more FB Blankets you order, the more per piece it costs to ship (1 costs $17.57, but 3 costs $59.79 or $19.93 a piece). So order the FB blanket three times to save money, instead of 3 at one time. The other components are just the opposite.

Bottom line - I think it is back to local acquisition of bricks, ordering the FB Blanket, FB Board and mortar, and driving the 150 miles to pick it up (and save an additional $160 in shipping costs).

Now I just need to get started...
Ed

[james]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

Hi guys,

Time for an update on the Pompeii Oven Kit. Getting all the logistics right for a product launch takes a little time.

First off -- all the materials for the Pompeii Oven Kits arrive this week! Yeah.

Sorry that we got the shipping costs wrong on the quotes that we sent out. We are fixing each of those, and resending them today. Here is the shipping cost schedule from the original posting announcing the kits. We are subsidizing shipping costs on the kits, and it is taking effort getting our systems to accommodate the new model.

NorCal $100
SoCal $150
Northwest $250
Mountain States $300
Texas $350
Midwest $400
East coast $500

If you are looking for a quote, contact Marina via email and fb.com. That's the best way to go for now. We are working on making the FB Store calculate the correct shipping amount, but it taking a little time and custom programming.

In terms of the cost of the kits themselves, I want to note that we have added two additional boxes of FB Blanket (a total of three) to the Pompeii110 kit, which explains the price increase. We made the decision to include all the dome insulation you need, so that you will not have to find a local source for vermiculite or order extra FB Blanket. It makes sense, that explains the price increase.

I think that does it.

If you have any questions, you can contact Marina at 800 407 5119 or send her email.

Enjoy!
James

[EADavis]

Re: FB Pompeii Oven Kit

Well, I broke down and ordered the Pompeii 90 kit this morning. With the subsidized pricing James is offering, the price is right, so I guess I have no more excuses! Now to get the time to build it...
Ed