Vesuvio 90 Replica Build

[Gulf]

My suggestion is to design the foot print of your oven a full scale on a cardboard template. Not the only way. Many use computer drafting programs. Those are just above my paygrade

[david s]

Regarding the removal of formwork, I usually give it 48hrs. Because there is so much free water to eliminate (see my experiment) I don't believe it's necessary to damp cure it for a week as there's so much free water stored in the perlite grains.

Have you counted how many bricks for the dome and floor that you'll require?
The Vesuvio 160 that I built required three of us to lift each of the 7 large 75mm thick castings around the floor, then the arch entry and one more smaller casting over the arch. At 1000kg excluding supporting slab and outer render, it's pretty heavy. Obviously if you are scaling it down it will be substantially lighter.

[david s]

I ‘ve realised I have misinterpreted what you wanted, my apologies. When you said a Vesuvio oven I thought you meant the original Italian Vesuvio ovens by Valiorani. I realise now that you probably meant the Vesuvio range by Forno Bravo. They are both cast modular builds not brick. There could be an advantage here for you because most cast builds have walls of only 2” thick, although some of the bigger ones are 3”. It can save you considerable space because at 2” thick that doubles to a saving of 4” in diameter over a brick oven. Because brick builds require a wall thickness of 4” to maintain structural integrity required because any brick structure requires a 4” wide course. Apart from saving you space a cast build can save a lot of time, taking weeks rather than months.

[Golfpro2301]

Gulf - Yes that is the plan to ensure what I have down on paper matches what I can do on stand. The dimensions of stand are below. The circles shown are a 48" outer circle that goes straight to edge and interior floor circle of 30". Its hard to measure exact distance between two with computer program so when I lay it out it will be exact. What program did you use for template?


David - Yes in regards to the vesuvio style by FB. Because I am not building a true dome style I figured I would need to cut bricks down small to make tight radius you see on the casa kits. I plan to cut the shape out of styrofoam to make sure I get the design and ceiling height I want. Because of the smaller bricks I am looking to get 160 to start. If that is not enough there is a dealer close by to get the rest. I left the stand covered the first night then removed cover for all of yesterday. I covered last night as a storm went through. I removed this morning and you can still see some areas still have water but most is drying out nicely and firming up. I will remove the forms later this afternoon which should allow more water to escape.

[Gulf]

......What program did you use for template?

No program. Just an old fashioned wooden yardstick, pencil, and a cardboard poster board from the dollar store. A small hole drilled at the 1" mark of yardstick and a push pin create a trammel. Another small hole drilled at the 16" mark to allow for inserting a pencil point will draw a 15" radius/30" circle and so on. Once you decide on the width and height of the inner arch, both top down and side views can be included of it and the entry. I color code the lines with colored sharpies to keep the confusion down in the field.

[david s]

Ok, but remember that departing from a hemisphere and creating a low dome does affect structural integrity for a brick build so the full width of 4” is doubly important. Brick builders attempting 2” thick domes have found in practice that the joints fail. In brick construction you don’t see walls built with bricks on edge because history has proved that 3” is inadequate. Remember also that an oven is subjected to considerable thermal expansion which places additional stress on the joints.

Regarding the perlcrete, it may appear to be dry, but it certainly won’t be deeper in. With around a third of the total volume in water added to the mix there is an enormous amount of free water sitting there. Because you are unable to weigh the slab, get a cheap garden moisture meter and plunge it deep into the perlcrete. Also read the experiment I attached to a previous post.

[Golfpro2301]

The dome will still be 4” thick. I plan to cut the 9” bricks in half and use these majority of time. When I get to tight radius from side walls to roof section was going cut 1” thick pieces still 4” wide so I can make the curvature better. This ok? Can open areas be filled with pieces of insulation then covered with refractory mortar?

[david s]

No, definitely not, using insulation in the joints reduces strength and density and inviting problems. They should be filled with mortar as well as the use of some of the cut off brick wedges.

[Golfpro2301]

Copy that. Thanks

[Golfpro2301]

Was able to do template today. This is based on 48” outer ring and 30” floor. The opening dimensions I copied from casa 80 kit drawings. If I leave some room on front side of oven it goes right to the edge. If I bring it forward all the way I can probably get another 2” so essentially a vesuvio 80. There will also be stone pavers and countertop around oven that will hang over a few inches. Scribbled in area is 4.5” firebrick

[Gulf]

An important thing to decide is the exact placement of the inner arch. Getting the inner arch too far forward will result in the dome brick not intersecting it at the correct point causing you to have to stretch the dome in order to make it work. Too far back means less oven space for the finished oven. To do this you will need to draw a side view. I do it all in full scale. But, JRPizza has some great examples that may help you in your computer drafting program to decide that placement. You can then replicate that work to your full scale. Remember also that the face of the inner arch is where the insulated door must fit. So the outer arch/entry is a little larger.

[Golfpro2301]

Thanks Gulf. Should have drawn out better but the 17” width and 9” depth is to what I believe you are referencing to. Here is snippit of casa 80 that shows what appears to be 1/2-3/4” stick out for door to seal up against.

[Golfpro2301]

Did some molds for two arches today. First one matches dimensions of casa 80 kit. Second is 1/2” bigger on each side and top so door has lip to seal against

my original plan was to put first course of bricks outside the floor but I am thinking it may be easier to go into small arch if first course is laid on floor. Is there pros/cons of either?

[Gulf]

I'm a little confused on what you are trying to do. Are you going to cast an inner arch first and then lay the brick dome into it?

[Golfpro2301]

No I am doing two brick arches. The inner most one will be 1/2” shorter all way around then the one closest to front of over. The larger arch will have the vent. Planning 6x8” opening and 6” stack out of center