Home Slice

[Unofornaio]

Re: Home Slice

One concern that comes to mind right away is the fact that this is going to be suspended by the arch bricks right? I don't know that is gonna be a nice downward load cantilevered off of half bricks.
The arch itself will hold a tremendous amount of direct downward load but what you have here is like....well its like if you were building a balcony on to a house and instead of going back and sistering onto the floor joist the length of the overhang or more (inside the house) you just put a ledger board and hung the balcony floor joist from that. You get my picture? I think you can put all the rebar you want in the casting but your weak point as I see it at this point is its attachment to the oven.
OK so lets play this out. Are you counting on the cladding to provide some extra strength above the arch if so how thick will the layer be right above the arch? this should act as a counter balance to the overhang but I'm just not sure it will be enough?? Its that row of arch brick carrying all the load that really has me concerned. Is there anyway you could post a pic of this setup straight on as if you are looking at it from the front of the oven opening?
Also don't forget to shove some insulation in the holes of the bricks where the rods are going in (actually wrapping them then putting them in would be the best because they are gonna expand from the heat it will surely crack the brick if not. I'm not sure about the expansion of ss in relation to regular steel but I'm sure its gonna expand some. Actually if someone could comment on the different expansion rates of ss vs reg steel I would appreciate it.

[Unofornaio]

Re: Home Slice

OK I saw a pic you posted and they look like they are full brick that will hold the rebar...I hit photo album next to your name and it came up with 4 photos I know you have posted more than that..right? anyway this full brick thing changes things a bit. Since I'm not familiar with the design of your oven style I don't know but it appears as though the dome then comes around and rides on these arch bricks is this correct?

[maver]

Re: Home Slice

Uno, nick planned in the past on having a suspension system to support this cantilevered vent - you're still proceeding with that, right nick?

[RTflorida]

Re: Home Slice

Nick, thanks for the kind words on my oven. I wish I could offer guidance on your project, your venturing into uncharted waters for me.
I've been curious all along as to what your suspended chimney will look like and more importantly how suppportive it actually is.

RT

[Unofornaio]

Re: Home Slice

Uno, nick planned in the past on having a suspension system to support this cantilevered vent - you're still proceeding with that, right nick?

Hey Maver,

I saw the drawing somewhere of the suspended hood from the poll in the back? Is that what you are referring to? Right now I'm concerned with balancing the load as close as possible between the 2 (suspending and cantilevered). There is going to be a lot of movement from expansion and contraction in this area and with a load on it either from the top carrying too much weight (pulling up sorta) or the arch carrying too much weight (downward) each time the oven gets hot its gonna exploit this tension area and sooner or later you will have separation. What I'm saying here is certainly not Gospel its just my 2 cents on the situation and I'm tying to figure it out as I go each time I get more information. I'll figure it out I think this is what he ultimately wants and I'm pretty sure it will work but its gonna take some tweaking.
See my basic theory behind this whole suspended vent situation is when you have any kind of load bearing point that is ridged (in this case the concrete that will make up the vent and attach it to the oven all in one)and you have movement (expansion/contraction) failure is eminent. As it is set up now the vent will be cast right on to the oven structure but they really must be treated like 2 separate pieces in my opinion because as soon as the dome expands the bond between the 2 is gonna break it has too its already basically a cold joint (where one pour butt up to another pour that has partially or fully cured) and since the plan is to just put the cladding on the oven and no enclosure we don't have a downward force to help out the equation. Or do we??? I have to look at some pics...

[redbricknick]

Re: Home Slice

Hey fellas, thanks for nutting this out with me.. The arch bricks are pretty much full bricks. The stainless rebar goes into six of these, two inches. That, plus additional rebar anchored into refractory mortar directly above the opening arch will support the full weight of the vent.. I originally planned on suspending the chimney, but the weight is so nominal that i reckon ill just let it sit on the vent.. I can stand on the stainless rebar coming out of the opening arch. Its bloody strong> my concerns lie in ading heat to the equation.. Do i need to secure the rebar into its holes at all? it fits in pretty snug, with enough room to expand if it needs to, though i figured with stainless, the expansion at pizza oven temperatures would be nominal. With the inclusion of additional support from above the opening arch, where do your additional concerns lay? Thanks fellas, i really appreciate the input..

[redbricknick]

Re: Home Slice

Yo. So after not hearing back from anyone, I went to talk to my mate Wayneo, who knows everything, and he told me i should anchor the arch rebar into the arch bricks with mortar.. He also advised me to notch up the rebar and faces of the arch bricks so the cast vent will have something to stick to.. So I'm pulling it to bits this week, in between preparing for a twenty first birthday party..

[Unofornaio]

Re: Home Slice

Yo. So after not hearing back from anyone, I went to talk to my mate Wayneo, who knows everything, and he told me i should anchor the arch rebar into the arch bricks with mortar.. He also advised me to notch up the rebar and faces of the arch bricks so the cast vent will have something to stick to.. So I'm pulling it to bits this week, in between preparing for a twenty first birthday party..

I did not see this post or I would have responded sooner sorry.
Let me say this right off the bat in this vast area of uncertainty regarding your project I can be certain of one thing, if you mortar in that rebar you will be increasing the likelihood of the arch failing.
A new concern for me is reading that the bar is only going in 2" it looks to me like you have somewhere between 8"-10" overhang there. At 8" you have 4 times the distance in overhang plus a load. Getting back to my balcony analogy, if this were a balcony and you had sistered on to the floor joist 2' and balcony went out 8' from there it would barley hold its self up let alone a person.
The photo/drawing was my original idea. Take a look and see what you think.

[james]

Re: Home Slice

Hey Nick,

Sorry about the destructo -- ma auguri di compleanno. 21 is a big one. What are you planning? Don't end up in the newspapers for the wrong reasons, but have a great time.

Best wishes from us.
James

[redbricknick]

Re: Home Slice

Poured the suspended vent today. its slow curing right now. Didn't take any pictures, heaps of video though, we were a little undermanned. Ate the first tomatos off the hanging tomato plants though. The Refmix is hot under the wet cotton t shirts i have it wrapped in.. Gonna be hard as a bastard.

[redbricknick]

Re: Home Slice

Alright boys and girls, here she is. The hanging vent. Its supported by six half inch pieces of stainless rebar which is ten inches long, three and a half of which is set into the arch bricks. There is a lot of other stainless rebar in her, two arch pieces, bent to shape, various cris crosses of threaded rod.. etc. A LOT of rebar.. Its holding up solid. Im going to keep wet curing it, then shape and polish with a grinder and sandpaper, insulate the top, and pray..

[redbricknick]

Re: Home Slice

so apparently you all think my vent is stupid, and are scared to tell me. Well I don't think its stupid, i think its awesome, and im going to have at it it with my grinder today, so there..

[redbricknick]

Re: Home Slice

Yeah, so blah blah, i ground and sanded the vent. It's awesome.. Blah Blah. Please. Someone. does the vent suck? I stood on it today, and it didn't fall down once. (once would have been enough) I'm going to the perlite factory on wednesday with the most beautiful girl in the world.

[ihughes]

Re: Home Slice

Don't lose your vision - even Da Vinci and Michaelangelo went to that bad place of doubt on occasion.

I for one think it looks great. If hey all looked the same it' d be a bit boring.

Besides, from what I can tell as long as it cooks great pizza who cares what it looks like. And any vent you can stand on is a vent worth working under.

Keep pushing the envelope.

[Archena]

Re: Home Slice

Um, you don't have any insecurity issues, do you?





Seriously, looks cool to me - but whatta I know? My whole experience is laying three dry laid double courses of brick - I'm probably not the best person to ask...