Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

[the_dr_masuess]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

Man! I just closed up my dome yesterday and It is not as neat and tidy on the outside for sure... and I'll know later today how the inside looks. I love your stainless thermal break too. It's nice having access to build such a piece. Yours looks awesome! Looks like it took quite a long time!

[kbartman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

Okay slight design mod here. I understand I only need a small thermal break but don't really want to completely redesign the stuff that remains. I've decided to form an arched U-channel to retain the upper insulating material. Similar to the entry sill that I already had planned except arched. This is made out of .012" (.3mm) stainless sheet. On the face, that leads into the chimney, I will use a 1/8" (3.2mm) stainless steel plate to retain the insulating material and prevent it from crumbling into my entry over time. Since it will now be fully contained, I'm thinking of using cal sil. or ceramic fiber blanket with a layer of vermiculite over it, then a final stucco coat for waterproofing.
Anyone see any issues with the new plan? Any preference of cal sil vs the blanket for this application?
Thanks

Nathan,
Congrats on plugging your dome. Awesome brick work and I love your CAD drawings and 3D modeling.

My concern is with your vent area and chimney/vent structure. Gulf and many others as myself, have our chimney structures constucted with two self supporting brick arches tie together with vent transition into the chimney structure and or vent pipe. Best as I can see of your with your 3-D model. Looks like you will not have a brick chimney and only a vent pipe. But my concern is the vent area, transition and vent pipe not being supported equally on both sides with two structurally sound arches of the same design. My concern is with the V-Crete, the thin stainless and their expansions, this may create some structural instability.

Just my humble opinion.

I really like the looks of the beautiful flowing curve of your vent transition. It should help channel that smoke up your vent nicely. How will this be supported and tied into the V-Crete and stainless on the back side of your vent area/transition?

[n8huntsman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

...my concern is the vent area, transition and vent pipe not being supported equally on both sides with two structurally sound arches of the same design.

Any ideas of how I can support the chimney and pipe without tying it into the dome? Here are some updated drawings trying to better show the .125" SS plate and .012" SS cladding.
You don't think the .125" plate is structurally sound enough to hold things together?

[n8huntsman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

I should have thought about this earlier, it may not be too late though. I could extend the .125" plate down to the bottom of the concrete and anchor it. If I did this do you think the .125" plate would be structurally sound enough to support everything?
If not, I may have to weld some gussets to it and beef it up.
Thoughts?

[kbartman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

I should have thought about this earlier, it may not be too late though. I could extend the .125" plate down to the bottom of the concrete and anchor it. If I did this do you think the .125" plate would be structurally sound enough to support everything?
If not, I may have to weld some gussets to it and beef it up.
Thoughts?

My concern were these bricks falling out if the mortar loosened over time. I'm curious what others think.

[n8huntsman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

I'll try to come up with some way of reinforcing them with some stainless steel. It's easier for me to work with metal than it is brick. Speaking of... I got my channels formed. When I finish the .125" plate, I'll use it as a guide to bend the curved channel.

[n8huntsman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

I should have thought about this earlier, it may not be too late though. I could extend the .125" plate down to the bottom of the concrete and anchor it. If I did this do you think the .125" plate would be structurally sound enough to support everything?
If not, I may have to weld some gussets to it and beef it up.
Thoughts?

I was able to modify the plate so it will now anchor to the 5.5" face of the concrete. I think I've decided (against KB's concerns) to push ahead with the design as shown. I hope I don't regret this decision but I made it after looking at many pictures of existing ovens and considering the structure of my design. Does anyone else have an opinion on this matter? The arch will be supporting about 4' of 8" duratech chimney pipe and two 45? elbows.
Thanks

[n8huntsman]

Thermal Break Support

I got this all fabricated and will do the final install tomorrow hopefully. The part that actually contacts the oven is .012″ (.3mm) Inconel for the high temps. The main face is .125″ (3mm) regular stainless. Next I can start the entry arch to support the chimney.

[deejayoh]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

That seems like a pretty good advancement on the heat break. I don't think you'll have any trouble with your entry arch. It's an arch... They're pretty strong. I would be cool if you thought about how your door mates with that stainless break. You could get a really good seal on that if you built it that way.

[n8huntsman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

That seems like a pretty good advancement on the heat break. I don't think you'll have any trouble with your entry arch. It's an arch... They're pretty strong. I would be cool if you thought about how your door mates with that stainless break. You could get a really good seal on that if you built it that way.

That's good reassurance regarding the arch. Thanks.
Somewhere along the journey my dimensions between the roof and oven drifted a little and my chimney is now off by about 8", interfering with the roof. I need an offset so I have two options.
1.) Use a short section, about 36", angled back 15? off the top of the arch, then a 15? elbow, and another 24" section extending above the roof.
2.) Come off the top of the arch directly into two 45's to create and offset then continue straight up. Not sure how you connect an elbow to the mounting plate or if that can even be done?

Which method do you guys think would be the best aesthetically and structurally?

Thanks

[david s]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

That's good reassurance regarding the arch. Thanks.
Somewhere along the journey my dimensions between the roof and oven drifted a little and my chimney is now off by about 8", interfering with the roof. I need an offset so I have two options.
1.) Use a short section, about 36", angled back 15? off the top of the arch, then a 15? elbow, and another 24" section extending above the roof.
2.) Come off the top of the arch directly into two 45's to create and offset then continue straight up. Not sure how you connect an elbow to the mounting plate or if that can even be done?

Which method do you guys think would be the best aesthetically and structurally?

Thanks

I use the two 45 degree bends. It means buying two bends rather than than one, but looks better IMO.

If you angle the pipe straight back off the top of the arch you may have trouble because when you cut it at an angle it will make an oval rather than a circle and the oval will increase the entry depth required. You may also have more difficulty attaching it to the top of the entry. A 15 degree bend may not be readily available and you may have to get one specially fabricated.

[DavidApp]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

Have you taken a look at Rodeair"s a "Pensacola Build".

He is doing the same type of thing and has what appears to be an interesting solution.

David

[valentin]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

You have done a lot since I visited this forum. And what is "regular stainless"? What it chromium and nickel content? The first element provides a heat-resistant steel, the second prevents rust when exposed to acids (formed in the combustion process) and moisture.

[n8huntsman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

...what is "regular stainless"? What it chromium and nickel content? The first element provides a heat-resistant steel, the second prevents rust when exposed to acids (formed in the combustion process) and moisture.

By regular stainless I was referring to 18-8, 18% Cr, 8% Ni. This is the most common type. That's what the .125" plate is made from, probably 302 but possibly 316, I didn't check it. It's on the cold side of the thermal break. The .012" piece is made from an alloy, Inconel 718, to handle the higher temps. 18-8 has issues with carbide precipitation at high temps and I had the Inconel available so I used it. At the temps we're at, carbide precipitation probably isn't an issue, but like I said, I had the material available.

[n8huntsman]

Re: Nathan's 36" SoCal WFO build

So I got the chimney laid out but even with a 30? elbow, I don't have the height to clear the roof. I see in the Canadian Duratech catalog they have 45's, part number 8dtc-e45ss, but I can't find any source for them online. Anybody know how I can get ahold of these? I'll have to make some calls tomorrow and see if I can find them.