42" In South GA

[Baza]

You are moving along amazing!!! WELL DONE!!!
I completely sympathize with you on the perseverating (analysis paralysis!) but you did the right thing and reached out in this forum to some amazing people!!
I know I couldn't have done anything without their sage advice!

The droop is a real thing - and I was lucky to avoid it using the lens Mongo shared - and remember - the cuts you make to meet the arch will NEVER be seen (except in this forum where there is an abundance of both forgiveness and understanding! ). So, if you have to tie in some 1/2 or 1/3 bricks and they are incongruous to the rest of that course - don't worry - only you will know!

Keep the pics coming!!
Barry

[mongota]

edonovan

Again...Awesome!! Thanks again everyone!! Minimal frustrations with this, maybe some cuts that provide some challenges when matching up with dome bricks... but nothing I can't live with... Great feeling to have this hurdle done!

I remember fou sort of "semi-great moments in building history" when I built my dome.
1) Getting the first course of brick set. "It has a shape!!"
2) Figuring out and finishing the arch. "In the end, much ado about nothing". I thought so much about HOW to do it in my head. But once I held the bricks up where they were supposed to go and saw the geometry they were supposed to take, it was all so very straightforward.
3) Covering the arch. "Dang. Now that looks like something." So much done, and although the dome plug seems to be within reach, at the same time the plug seems so very very far away.
4) Plugging the dome. "DUN". Time for a beer. Now on to the tunnel!

When you cover the arch, I found it easiest to have the brick-to-be-cut in the IT, held next to its intended position. Scribe an inside and outside cut line on the brick, connect the lines, and cut. Put the brick in the IT and test fit. Repeat as needed. They don't need to be amazing cuts. Mortar will fill the gap. But you don't want so much mortar that the brick slumps, nor do you want so little that you have brick touching brick and you can't tap the brick fully in to its intended position.

To prevent arch droop, it might help to use a half- or third-brick (depending on how high you are in the build) and cut that to fit against the arch. Then work away from the arch, infilling between that cut arch brick and the other bricks already in that course. I've noticed droop in builds where guys try to use a brick an inch or two longer than those half- or third-bricks already in the course. They try to reach the arch with one long brick versus a half- or third-brick plus a small infill. Or droop can occur when you use small infill pieces. If infilling, watch the height of the IT above the oven floor. Keep it consistent so the small infill pieces don't get set low. Low = droop.

Sorry to ramble!
Good work, the plug is close. But no too close! lol

[Giovanni Rossi]

edonovan, I've enjoyed following your build. It must feel great to have completed this critical step. I want to echo everything you've written about the primary contributors’ value to this forum. I also want to highlight one tip for those of us still in the planning stage that I haven’t seen before and I’m sure I would overlook in an attempt to make accurate cuts.

From JRPizza: “The angle you cut on the upper surface should be steep enough so you have room for some mortar.” I’m sure this detail is second nature to those well versed in this type of construction, but not for me.

All the best as you finish your dome. Giovanni

[edonovan]

Again...Awesome!! Thanks again everyone!! Minimal frustrations with this, maybe some cuts that provide some challenges when matching up with dome bricks... but nothing I can't live with... Great feeling to have this hurdle done!

[edonovan]

If no one has told you guys lately....YOU ARE AWESOME!! Thank you UtahBeehiver, MarkJerling, JRPizza, mongota !! It was definitely good for me to walk away from it last week, and come at it with a new set of eyes. Between knowing that this is the most difficult part for builders to visualize and mark telling me to not over think it, really helped me think this easier than I am making it. Well, reading through Mongo's "string method" was easier to visualize without having to try hold a brick in my IT and mark bricks and everything...it just starting clicking!! Have company this weekend and the big FL/GA game...so probably not too much happening this weekend...but I do feel SOOO much better about moving forward and progressing along less stressed!! Thank you again everyone!!

[JRPizza]

If the arch is located properly, meaning it will intersect the dome without going out of round, there are a few inches of forward/aft location you can play around with. Forward more and you will have more arch protruding from the dome and less to cut off the TDC brick. Aft more and the opposite happens. My arch is not all the way forward but I have a pretty good amount sticking out. The pics below shows how much I cut off, which is similar to what Russell showed. Your's looks in the ball park to me. In my second pic you can better see where I have drawn an arc representing the ID. The angle you cut on the upper surface should be steep enough so you have room for some mortar.

[mongota]

I agree with Mark, I think your second photo looks just fine.

If Russell's photo, which is terrific, didn't help? This may not, as it's pretty much the same thing...but this link sort of shows the arch brick in place on the arch. It may help the visualization a bit. My layout to achieve the cut lines on the arch bricks is just slightly different than Russell's for one of the cut references. I simply used where the bottom edge of the brick met the inside face of the arch template as the third reference point on the bottom of my arch brick instead of using the ID of the dome on the bottom edge of the brick.

Set your brick in place upon the template. Draw a line along the side face of the arch brick that follows the line from the orange to yellow dots. That would be along the red line in my photo. Then draw another line on the side of the brick that follows the inside diameter of your dome. I used the inside dome diameter (the yellow dot) as one referecne point but then used where the brick sits on the arch template (blue dot) as the other reference point fo that second cut. Simply my choice.

Here's the link to the pic, there's a bit more text on my post explaining the dots and cut lines. https://community.fornobravo.com/for...414#post392414

[MarkJerling]

Don't overthink it. The way you have it in your second photo looks fine!

[edonovan]

I think the more I read I am complicating it more in my head or something......I read over several builds, looked over UtahBeehiver tips on the arch and tying in the dome (and reading that this is the most difficult part for builders to visualize.), go back outside look...stare...hold up bricks...cut scrap bricks...and something still isn't working correctly for me. I am hoping that my arch placement isn't too far in the dome. First picture is a side shot and you may be just able to make out a pencil mark inside the arch form...that is my ID...If I place a tape underneath my arch dome that mark is right at about 2" from my heat break/ front of arch (23" from center). The next picture is what I have been coming up with, although obviously if I were to hold up my brick in my IT it would not sit correctly on my arch TDC, also I keep questioning if that is where the dome brick is supposed to intersect the arch or is it lower on the arch brick. I have tried marking the OD on the top of the brick, the problem comes in when I try to mark ID...the ID mark is still on top of the TDC (when working with a full brick) and that just throws me all off. So walking away from it today, I cut some more bricks in half for more dome bricks when the time comes...if this arch doesn't beat me.

[UtahBeehiver]

See it this helps.

[edonovan]

I really enjoy working in cooler weather!! Finally...
although, I have looked over several builds and something just isn't making sense from a visual on this arch. Based on JRPizza measurements in post #62 here, the front of his arch (for a 39) was 22.5 from center, mine being a 42 I went to 23" (front of brick).
1) Why visually when I hold the brick up to make sense of tying in arch (that is TDC brick) (pic #1) it looks like I am cutting away most of the brick? shouldn't it be tying in more towards the back of the brick (picture #2)
2) I don't have a whole lot of room to move forward without adding more bricks to entry as (pic #3) my entry is 12" 1/4 which is just enough for my 8" base plate once I get into venting.
3) Very fearfully cut my heat break in my floor (# 4) should I leave it around 1/4" wide and shove some high heat rope in there and let ash fill the rest up or butt up against oven floor?

[edonovan]

That is what I thought...and why I am at a slower pace as I get this arch figured out before going higher. Thanks again

[UtahBeehiver]

The arch layout should be figured out before you go too high. So you can form the arch, cut and align, mark the mortar joints. Then you have two choices, mortar in. Then you don't need to worry abt keeping ahead of the dome or mortar in arch bricks as you move up in the dome but keeping the arch bricks higher than the dome bricks.

[edonovan]

Thanks UtahBeehiver I had totally forgot about the leave the day with an anchor brick for the next time...thanks for that...not 100% sure what you mean about "staying ahead of the dome"... do you mean don't keep going up with my courses until I get the arch figured out? Also, great tidbit on the narrow ones towards the inside front half. I will be cutting/angling the arch bricks to tie in on the inside arch but am working with a 10" chop saw and angle grinder so "beveling/tapering" is challenging/ just not happening and will probably be similar to Baza, (in the form of not tapered) but not the squished down arch, an arch like JRPizza. It is just going to have decent size mortar joints on the backside of the bricks.

Different note...excited for winter knocking on the door...coming to Utah this year with the family!!

[UtahBeehiver]

Welcome back after your sabbatical. Here are a few tidbits to help you with the arch. Keep the arch ahead of the dome, it is much easier to tie into the tapered arch then cutting a complex brick to tie into the dome. The last brick of the day, place one on back center of the new course so it can set and gives you an anchor to work from. Do you best line up, joint staggers, work on the back half of the dome and makeups, chips (narrow than normal) on the front half. No one can see the makeups on the front half once to dome is complete. Review the concept of a tapered inner arch, remember these arch bricks are not the same so DON'T cut them all alike all at once, use your IT to help mark angles. I suggest you mark the top dead center brick first (which will be the longest) then work down either side. Remember you need to start with full length bricks not halfs.