Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

[stonecutter]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

"....... but the advantage of it is that it usually contains a variety of grain size which is a desirable quality, we call it cracker dust....

What you call cracker dust is considered graded aggregate and varied particle size is exactly what is needed for the best quality concrete.

Basalt should be a nice aggregate to use because of its hardness. There are several variables to reduce cracking-not using too much or too little water, correct ratio of binder/aggregate ( not too much of either), curing process ( this is not drying by fire either ) and density.

Are you mixing volumetrically?

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Are you mixing volumetrically?

Yes I am.
I even have clay that I am thinking of replacing with fire brick dust in the 6:1:1:1 formula since the last is fused.
I can find and provide the aggregate basalt if it is crucial to the mix.
Could you elaborate the volumes including the water as well as the cracking prevention techniques in more details?

[jeffreybenge]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Hey there,
That's a fantastic idea of converting your brick oven into a steel one. Very aesthetic and eco-friendly it will be. I loved your idea. Great job! Definitely its going to be one of the most interesting thing in your house - a steel oven!

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Hey there,
That's a fantastic idea of converting your brick oven into a steel one. Very aesthetic and eco-friendly it will be. I loved your idea. Great job! Definitely its going to be one of the most interesting thing in your house - a steel oven!

Glad you like it. The reason for choosing steel was fuel efficiency, fast start up time, and more interior space.
However, in my experimental runs, I found that a bit more of thermal mass will let me gain some retained heat cooking without degrading the performance in a considerable way, so I'm now in the stage of cladding my oven with a 1" layer of bricks. That is roughly twice more efficient than my old brick oven. Couldn't reduce the unneeded-to-me thermal mass to 1" of wall thickness without steel.
I've just made some modifications to it; enlarged the vent, and adapted the oven to be clad with the thermal mass.

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Since I am going to enclose the oven and the flu as it is an indoor one, replacing the flu in case it wears is not an option.

The one in the picture above will not live for long. It is less than 1 mm thick. Thus, I'm going to replace it with a thicker one. I wasn't lucky to find a flue of 2 mm thick steel. I found 5 mm thick one available. I am afraid that is too thick for the application and may suck up lots of heat.
Do you think that a flu with a thicker wall will affect fuel efficiency provided that the contact area with the vent top is the same in both?

[jeffreybenge]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Glad you like it. The reason for choosing steel was fuel efficiency, fast start up time, and more interior space.
However, in my experimental runs, I found that a bit more of thermal mass will let me gain some retained heat cooking without degrading the performance in a considerable way, so I'm now in the stage of cladding my oven with a 1" layer of bricks. That is roughly twice more efficient than my old brick oven. Couldn't reduce the unneeded-to-me thermal mass to 1" of wall thickness without steel.
I've just made some modifications to it; enlarged the vent, and adapted the oven to be clad with the thermal mass.

Hi v12spirit,
Well I can't applaud you more for choosing steel. I am a great fan of everything steel as I'm an extremely environment conscious guy. Even I got my entire house remodeled into a steel building from steel buildings denver and added a pole barn to the backyard of my house. My house seems so much more modern and elegant now!

[david s]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Yes, a thick steel flue connected to the rest of the steel oven will suck heat away because steel is so conductive. I think you would be better off using a thin walled (0.55 mm), but stainless steel flue pipe that won't corrode, but won't suck much heat out of your steel oven.

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

I am considering cladding my oven. I have two options; cladding the entire dome, and cladding just the covex cap without the side walls. According to the q=c m dt law, the second option saves half the heat up thermal energy and time, being saving half the extra mass (m). The first results in 90 kg extra weight, while the second results in up to 50 kg. Something's telling me that things are not bound proportionally i.e. the 90 kg will not require twice the heat required to saturate the 50kg (even if the law states that), Another thing is telling me that they are quite peoportional that with the 90 kg I will end up with amassive oven that will take a while to clear.
My math sayes that the first option will require up to 6.6 kg wood to clear while the second will require up to 4.2 kg dry wood. In practice I hope to drop below 2 kg of wood which still looks vage to achieve.
In both cases, my oven is still light compared to brick ovens its size and should be more efficient, but that still is not the efficiency I have been seeking. I prefer to refer to heat up effeciency in terms of the weight of required wood rather than heat up time. my goal is to accept the maximum thermal mass that lets the oven clear in less than 2 kg of dry wood.
Any comments are truly appreciated.

[Brave]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

wow interesting build. I'd never really consider using steel. I think it's generally an intimidating material to build with if you haven't done so before. I think I'd still prefer the outside to resemble a brick oven with the traditional look however.

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

wow interesting build. I'd never really consider using steel. I think it's generally an intimidating material to build with if you haven't done so before. I think I'd still prefer the outside to resemble a brick oven with the traditional look however.

I have been disappointed with how long time and how much calories brick ovens take to start, so I decided to incorporate steel with bricks so the steel acts as a prompt that charges the lazy bricks. I hope I end up with a fast to start yet heat-holding oven. i will be enclosing with bricks so that one cannot know that it is steel until one examines it very closely.

[Brave]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Definitely a good idea spirit. The only other aspect I can think of to reduce the fire up time would be more insulation, and perhaps funnel the chimney smoke back over the top of the oven like in a Neapolitan oven. That way not so much heat is lost through the chimney without use.

[TropicalCoasting]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

I have been disappointed with how long time and how much calories brick ovens take to start, so I decided to incorporate steel with bricks so the steel acts as a prompt that charges the lazy bricks. I hope I end up with a fast to start yet heat-holding oven. i will be enclosing with bricks so that one cannot know that it is steel until one examines it very closely.

Check this design out it may give you some ideas of making a more efficient use of wood to heat.
Basically a rocket stove with a an insulated metal oven above using heat to vent evenly around the oven before it exits out of the chimney.
http://brockwell-bake.org.uk/Rocket_...ven_manual.pdf

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Definitely a good idea spirit. The only other aspect I can think of to reduce the fire up time would be more insulation, and perhaps funnel the chimney smoke back over the top of the oven like in a Neapolitan oven. That way not so much heat is lost through the chimney without use.

Exactly. If you look at the flu you can see that it is the squirrel tail type which will allow the dome to be heated from both sides.

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Check this design out it may give you some ideas of making a more efficient use of wood to heat.

Thank you for the link Tropicalcoasting. This is very close to my likings; to make things multifunction. I am doing something similar in my build but in another way.
The only drawback in that design is that it may hardly get to pizza temps I reckon. It is very suitable for bradbaking however.

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Ready to clad the oven. Some update pictures on the steel skeleton will be posted soon.
Question: Is this material (sodium metasilicate pentahydrate granular) lime?