My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

[kbartman]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Bruce,
By the looks of your pics on your thread I notice you may have used a wooden pizza peel to check your joints. I simulated a metal peel with my square edged trowel. I read that the wooden peels are used mainly for placing pizzas. The heat takes a toll on them. A metal peel may catch more.

[Bec1208]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Bruce,
No sander involved, just play sand purchased at the local home improvement store.

Gives new meaning to sanding.

Just finished laying out bricks on the insulation. Taking a break now. Thanks for the reply. Bruce

[kbartman]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

PS. Can you see the three y's neatly staggered in the text of the post? I planned thator is it just stipidity?................. I hope I have the same luck staggering my course joints, LOL

Ok my bad it changes per computer monitor. It was neat to see the three y's neatly staggered.

[kbartman]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

I apparently skipped over this post and just caught it when I looked to see if you had described sanding the floor. I agree with your reasoning.

There are numerous sites on the web that will convert MPa to psi (.5 MPa converts to 72.52 psi). If you want to try an experiment, you could stack 20 or more bricks on an area of the board you plan to cut off. Based on 5 lbs per brick, that would be 100 lbs on an 9" x 4" surface. The psi would be 100/36=2.78 psi. Any compression should be small and uniform.

As you pointed out lots of builds have used fb (and other) boards and I have not seen a single report of failure related to the board. Either it works or James is running one hell of a scam.

Ok just notice after composing hope the additional description help.

[kbartman]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Agree that your floor looks very good, could you describe your technique (e.g., type of sander used ect...), either on this thread or on yours? Thanks, Bruce

I made so progress since my big scare on Friday. After the floor was set and first course lay I found some rocking in floor, which I did not like. Thinking about a tear down at this point, I remembered briefly reading a thread on some putting sand inside the dome for support and someone else sanding the floor. Without any further reading on the subject, I thought to myself, why in the world would some do that? I only envisioned a gritty pizza. ??....... I decide to try a little sand on the floor.

Bruce,
No sander involved, just play sand purchased at the local home improvement store. The fire brick and substrate is not perfect has some imperfections causing misalignments and unevenness. Remembering brick pavers and the sanding between the joints I thought the sand would do the same for the floor. The sand flows, thanks to gravity and the spray bottle or water hose on the pavers ( I would not recommend a water hose on the oven floor do to insulation becoming saturated) to fill all the imperfections. As the sand flows downward to fill all imperfection the bricks become tightly locked together. I believe the brick and sand on substrate will behave as one unit with gravity to keep the floor level. As I worked the sand into the joints and rocked the brick to levelness I paid more attention to the corners off the herring bone pattern that the pizza peel would chip easily. I made sure they were below the 45 degree angle of the herring bone pattern to the oven door of adjacent bricks. I started with a rubber mallet to get the sand into the joints, and then tried the spray bottle. It worked wonders to allow the sand to disappear into the voids. Thinking the hammering of the rubber mallet and too much sand could cause to much outward expansion (too much could cause the bricks to expand to the oven walls causing my expansion joint disappear or fail. I was carful around the edges and figure ash would complete the job. As far as gritty pizza I figure a vacuum cleaner to remove just enough sand and ash would fill the left voids and prevent the gritty pizza.

[Bec1208]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Al,
I'll take some pics when I get home this morning. The over all compression of the board seems ok with three courses set. A slight indention of maybe 1/8". My biggest concern was the bricks rockin on the floor. The sand seems to have solve this. Placing a brick on the insulation and placing pressure evenly down very little compression, as the pressure is applied unevenly or in the corner the brick, would rock slightly. This seems ok and makes sense the board isn't rock hard. Small surface area of the corners would cause more deflection. I may have softened the top layer a little around the joints trying to even them up. All the material is still there just a little softer do to my stupidy. I feel it should all compress to the original state after the bricks are set. With the floor tightly locked In place it shoud move as one large surface area and evenly compress the board to spec. We could probaly firgure that out. If I remember correctly I think the compression .5 Mpa. Not sure how to figure that.

I apparently skipped over this post and just caught it when I looked to see if you had described sanding the floor. I agree with your reasoning.

There are numerous sites on the web that will convert MPa to psi (.5 MPa converts to 72.52 psi). If you want to try an experiment, you could stack 20 or more bricks on an area of the board you plan to cut off. Based on 5 lbs per brick, that would be 100 lbs on an 9" x 4" surface. The psi would be 100/36=2.78 psi. Any compression should be small and uniform.

As you pointed out lots of builds have used fb (and other) boards and I have not seen a single report of failure related to the board. Either it works or James is running one hell of a scam.

[Bec1208]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Bruce,
Nice floor moving right along. Consider the sanding I did on my floor I?m really pleased with how my turned out.

Agree that your floor looks very good, could you describe your technique (e.g., type of sander used ect...), either on this thread or on yours? Thanks, Bruce

[Bec1208]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Ceramic Fibre board will compress to nearly nothing with enough weight and time.

Al, of course with enough weight and time a lump of coal becomes a diamond.
Bruce

[kbartman]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

You can see my confusion. I value Brickie's and Forno Bravo's opinion. Talking with the entire local supplier?s even added more confusion. Cost was one of the main reason but also the reason I used the FB board, I felt the FB plans were a proven design.

[kbartman]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Bruce,
No apologies necessary. I'm the one that stays confused and have been known to confuse others with my confusion here is a quote from brickie to consider.

Sorry, no warm fuzzy feelings to offer.

The FB board means Forno Bravo board which is actually a Calcium Silicate board and doesnt compress nearly as much as Ceramic Fibre board.
Ceramic Fibre board will compress to nearly nothing with enough weight and time.

Just as well I saw that you had problems before you got too far.
I know its a bummer but better to rebuild it now than in 2 months time.

[Bec1208]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

What is CF? I edited the post I checked the spec sheet mine is Alumina Silicate
board.........I'm confused

I have been using that as a quick way to designate standard Ceramic Fiber board from what I have been calling biosoluble.

This is from the Skyline site:

Standard ceramic fiber board is made of aluminum silicate ceramic fibers
with a small amount of organic binders. Bio-soluble board is made of
calcium/magnesium silicate fibers with a small amount of organic
binders.

Probably bad labeling on my part. Sorry for confusion. Bruce

[kbartman]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Sorry, no warm fuzzy feelings to offer.
The FB board means Forno Bravo board which is actually a Calcium Silicate board and doesnt compress nearly as much as Ceramic Fibre board.
Ceramic Fibre board will compress to nearly nothing with enough weight and time.

What is CF? I edited the post I checked the spec sheet mine is Alumina Silicate
board.........I'm confused

[Bec1208]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Thanks Bruce for the conversion. Did you use the ceramic fiber board or is it the cal sil board? I made the mistake of calling my board ceramic fiber board. Mine is Cal sil.

I have one layer all CF and lower level has one section of Cal sil. Bruce

[kbartman]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Bruce,

When you get done trimming the Ca Sil to where you want, take your leftover mortar as you lay your bricks and render the sides of the Ca Sil board. The mortar will keep the Ca Sil from getting damaged, broken, dented while you do your dome.

Thanks Bruce for the conversion. Did you use the ceramic fiber board or is it the cal sil board? I made the mistake of calling my board ceramic fiber board. Mine is Alumina Silicate
board.

Utahbeehiver,

I thought about putting mortar around the bottom like yours. I had some very small pudding of water on top the stand, which I drilled drainage holes in middle of them, thinking water could be trapped. Wondering if the mortar around it might trap water also

[Bec1208]

Re: My 40" Inch pizza oven in Florida

Bruce,

When you get done trimming the Ca Sil to where you want, take your leftover mortar as you lay your bricks and render the sides of the Ca Sil board. The mortar will keep the Ca Sil from getting damaged, broken, dented while you do your dome.

Sounds like good advice. If the material stays in place I will do this.

I tried calculating the lbs per sq. inch placed on the board below the perimeter brick. I expected the result to be low, but not as low as I calculated and this was with higher then expected dome weigh. In addition at least some of the load will be transferred to the remaining board. I hope someone checks my math.

I used the following formula and values:
Weight of dome (estimated to be 2000 lbs)/Area of space between inner and outer perimeter of bricks
The first value was ((pi x 22 squared) - (pi x 18 squared))=503 sq inches
So 2000/503=4 lbs per sq inch.

Really doesn't sound like much. According to a conversion site on the web, .3 is about 44 psi and .5 is about 73 psi.

I found this definition of MPa in connection with material compression strength:


bonehead...
MPa is one million pascals.

A pascal, Pa, is one newton per square meter (N/m^2)

So a MPa is one million newtons per square meter.

"In material strength, it represents how much stress (force per cross sectional area) that a material can withstand without breaking/rupturing/stretching or whatever other criteria you use for failure."
What is MPa stand for when it comes to material strength? - Yahoo! Answers

Anyone comment who has experience with this issue. Thanks, Bruce