new build in werribee

[cobblerdave]

Re: new build in werribee

Gudday Colin
This is starting to sound ... Well a little bit familiar.
A 7 Month period since conception.
The dome is just about complete in its full roundness.
The entry is planned but not yet complete....
Is this baby really ready to be born?
Regards dave

[oasiscdm]

Re: new build in werribee

Nice one Dave About 2 months left its in 3rd trimester. Due date Xmas day. No way it will be prem.

[kbartman]

Re: new build in werribee

So if all goes according to plan I should have some more pics up over the next few days of Dome completion and landing under way.

Hey Collin,
Wondering how things are going. Was looking forward to those pics. Hope all went according to plan.

I'm procrastinating and my stucco. Looking for some motivation.

[oasiscdm]

Re: new build in werribee

Hi KB

Well I did have a whole host of photo's to post but made a big booboo. I had worked on my landing as I had issues with my keystone when I got it back. So it cannot go in yet and I wont get it back now until end of November.

So I moved to my landing spent some time reforming my arch forms to accommodate the change in plans. I am doing the Flared entry as I posted ages ago, ummed and arrhed but in end why not. I am rebating the back edge around the entry arch [like yours KB] by around 75mm. Dropping the front form about 1.5" lower than the rear like John's (Octoforno) [have been discussing this with him for a while as he was doing much the same thing, thx John much apprecaited].

Got too the course 5 jthe point I start the flue gallery and when swapping emails with John I noticed a major flaw based on his figures. I would have had only 5" x 20" to the opening of the vent, for an 8" flue tapering would have reduced it further - damn shit bum poo not happy . Took to what I had done with a rubber mallet.

Do you know it took ages laying it [see Octoforno post quite tricky to do working on multiple plains] but only 3 minutes to demolish it .... Cleaned the bricks made some mods and now I have 9.5" front to back and still the 20" width before the bricks form the flue. I will be having minimal depth on the rear Flue gallery arch.

I managed to lay 2.5 rows before dark caught up with me. As I said it is quite fiddly matching the forms of differing heights and widths but its much easier to do the second time. So pretty much have got little done in 4 days thanks to the demolition job.

You can see how I gained the extra length with the vertical brick I placed at the front of the base. This means my decorative arch will now only be 2" thick.

[oasiscdm]

Re: new build in werribee

Well I got the reworked landing done - Photo's below.

I just want to acknowledge John [Octoforno] for his assistance in sharing his knowledge with me while he achieved completion of his landing. Like Johns landing mine is flared and lower at the front making the angles quite awkward. John actually invented the twisted brick. . The only difference is I rebated my landing around the Entry Arch. I was originally going to have a full reveal [landing going completely around the Entry Arch] but decided KB look was more appealing. This method has isolated the landing completely from the dome. The cardboard template I made is in the previous post, made the marking and cutting easy.

Hopefully I will get the rest of the landing done this weekend.

Dome still not closed - I promise it will be soon.

With a Selfie and also the dog sunning itself in the garden.

[Liteceeper]

Re: new build in werribee

Hi Colin
Landing coming along nice, like the thermal break, waiting to see the keystone.
Dog looks like he/she enjoying the Japanese Garden, thought being the supervisor would object to the Japanese safety boots.

[oasiscdm]

Re: new build in werribee

Hi Colin
Landing coming along nice, like the thermal break, waiting to see the keystone.

Thx liteceeper. Me too

[UtahBeehiver]

Re: new build in werribee

Hey Colin,

Flared landing is looking good. All the detail work on the dome prepared you for the multiple angles of a flared entry. Almost there............

[oasiscdm]

Re: new build in werribee

I can taste it. Hey Russell will be looking at your flute construction soon. Hopefully next weekend.

[kbartman]

Re: new build in werribee

Nice work on the the flared entry.........You have much more confidence in yourself than I had for myself when I considered the flared landing briefly. I said no way after thinking about all the complicated cuts and decided the on the kiss principle. The twisted brick idea would have been far above my pay grade.

I really wanted to have a lip of some sort to help channel the smoke up the chimney. I was a little concerned that I would have smoke coming out the front of my oven entry. After firing the oven I decided the draw on the chimney was working pretty good and decided I could omit the lip on my decorative arch. This allowed more room to maneuver tools and such. The twisted brick idea gives you the best of both worlds. I was a little worried about being oversized on my flue, but at this point all seems well.

Can't wait to see more, keep up the good work.

Ps. My taped thermocouple end idea failed. I should have used a higher temperature glass tape. I pulled the TC located on the very top of the dome. It had seen temps upwards to 900F and was still working but I decided to pull it to have a check, the tape and PFE insulation was shot. All the others are still working fine. Although I did buy a spool of the high temperature fiber glass wire and replaced the one. I may leave the others till they go bad.

[oasiscdm]

Re: new build in werribee

Thx KB

I just wish to ensure John [Octoforno] gets credit for the twisted brick idea. When doing a flared arch the way John and I have [where the front landing arch is lower and wider than the rear landing arch] and you place the bricks [dry fit] you can see the angles that need to be shaved to maintain the brick faces on the inside of the landing.

You only need to maintain this until you get to the landing flue gallery.

Then the bricks need to maintain being parallel front to back as these flue gallery bricks begin to follow a line to the middle of the landing [away from the entry arch itself], due to the angle [flare] of the supporting structure below more shaving and measuring. Very fiddly but was actually fun.

Just remember I had a lot of assistance from John in achieving this he pioneered it on his build and provided pictures to me as he completed his, he is a source of so much valuable detailed information.

All I added was the isolation technique of rebating the front landing around the Entry arch and ceramic tape like you did KB.

I will post some process pictures later showing the technique I followed, including templates I made to assist the process.

Shame about the thermocouples KB priced some the other day $38 for the thermo couple, $54 for the thermo well, $12 for a coupling. they were stainless steel 6mm but to me way to much.

[kbartman]

Re: new build in werribee

Ps. My taped thermocouple end idea failed. I should have used a higher temperature glass tape. I pulled the TC located on the very top of the dome. It had seen temps upwards to 900F and was still working but I decided to pull it to have a check, the tape and PFE insulation was shot. All the others are still working fine. Although I did buy a spool of the high temperature fiber glass wire and replaced the one. I may leave the others till they go bad.

Shame about the thermocouples KB priced some the other day $38 for the thermo couple, $54 for the thermo well, $12 for a coupling. they were stainless steel 6mm but to me way to much.

Colin,
Remember this post? You can have it all for less then you think.

Hey Guys,

No worry about mucking up the thread, this discussion is all good here.

Dee,

Thanks for the great info. I just purchased that controller less the relay, heat sink and added a thermocouple that is better suited to install in my oven door for a grand total !!!!!!!!!!!! wait for it.....................$5.83 Let me say that again.......... $5.83............................. I got free shipping and a $30 instant savings ..........

I didn't know amazon had such great deals. I can't thank you enough Dee.

Colin,
I have access to scrap thermocouple extension wire, so my cost is just my time to twist the two extension wires together and tape. The only reason I used the fiberglass tape, was the extension wire I used was only good to about 480F. I figured taping them would keep the two PFA insulated wires from shorting together before the formed twisted measuring junction which makes the thermocouple. With the tubing I used as thermo wells , I can easily pull out and replace if they go bad. A 100ft spool of fiberglass insulated wire rated at about 890F would be better suited not have to be taped, allow for multiple configurations and locations for about 60 cent a foot. TC Direct for Temperature Sensing, Measurement and Control

Don't get me wrong the premade's are a great deal and would probably hold up better, But having a spool on hand allows one to customize and repair on a whim.

AGPtek? 1/16 DIN Digital PID Temperature Controller SNR & Alarm SNR (1 alarm) - Amazon.com

Thermocouple Lead Wire by TEMPCO - Thermocouple Wire by Zoro Tools Industrial Supplies

I'm using the PID controller for the temperature read out I would say the homemade thermo well would be the biggest expense. I was told that old brake lines are stainless and would work. If one is not to concerned with heat loss I think copper tubing would work. I used some 3/8" scrap stainless tubing on mine, 1/4" tubing would work better (I did not realize how small the wire would be).......... You can have as many as you want. I have a total of six installed so far and will end up with about ten. No tubing needed for the ones on the floor just a hole drilled thru my hearth and insulation into the floor brick.

[oasiscdm]

Re: new build in werribee

Thx KB great info, I checked those links. TC direct Aus was where I got my pricing. I noticed on Amazon they have high temp stainless tc for $7 only 100 insertion.

This sounds daft but the techno wells and tc how does that work. Does the tc stick out the end of the well, how do you fasten the tc and the thermowell? Or do you just poke them in. Do you have any pics? The guy from tcdirect is recommending 250 tc with 180 or 200 thermowell. That's what I'm not getting. eg to the bottom of the hearth it's 125mm. So I was looking at 150mm tc's.

Hmmm

[kbartman]

Re: new build in werribee

Thx KB great info, I checked those links. TC direct Aus was where I got my pricing. I noticed on Amazon they have high temp stainless tc for $7 only 100 insertion.

This sounds daft but the techno wells and tc how does that work. Does the tc stick out the end of the well, how do you fasten the tc and the thermowell? Or do you just poke them in. Do you have any pics? The guy from tcdirect is recommending 250 tc with 180 or 200 thermowell. That's what I'm not getting. eg to the bottom of the hearth it's 125mm. So I was looking at 150mm tc's.

Hmmm

We ain't building rockets or power plants. We just want to be able to read the temperature of the bricks. We don't need all the fancy highly accurate instrumentation and thermowells etc.......

A thermocouple is made up of two dissimilar metals wires, when they touch together and are hook up to a meter, they form the circuit and electricity is generated. The very low voltage generated can be read on most any millivolt meter. Basically this voltage changes as temperature changes. This voltage reading can be referenced to charts, tables etc. and the temperature at the measuring junction (where the two wires are touching) can be determined.

So all that is needed is to stick the wires twisted together in a hole against the brick and connect them to your temperature read out device. Thermo wells are just used to protect the measuring junction and to serve as a conduit to allow that junction to be placed near the heat source you are measuring. The thermo well can be made of anything your heart desires

The PID controller I bought has all the info charts,tables and circuitry etc. inside to determine the temperature from the voltage coming in on the two dissimilar metal wires.

I drilled two holes into the brick a small one, and one slightly larger then the tubing I used. I then and inserted one end of the tubing into the brick, then drilled the same two holes, the smaller thru the hearth to below and inserted the other end of the tubing in the larger hole.Then I strapped the tubing to support and keep either ends from coming out of the holes. I pushed the wire into the tubing from below and out the end touching the bricks on the dome (You would want to electrically insulate, if your homemade thermocouple was to end inside a metal conductive tubing of some sort).

At this point below my hearth is just mess of wires stucking out of the holes in the concrete going to different location on the oven. I plan on tiding up and protecting them inside the wood storage area. All the wires will terminated inside a junction box where the PID controller will display the temperature read out.

Hope this clears any muddy water I stirred up. I'll post pictures of any thing you would like better detail on, just let me know.

[oasiscdm]

Re: new build in werribee

No muddy waters stirred up KB and thanks for that. How much of the TC do you stick out the end of the tube.

A pic of the TC in your tube [out of the oven] would be helpful in showing this and how you keep it in place. The ones I looked at, at TC Direct had some type of coupling.

I will post the pictures later of the process for the landing and flue gallery but this is where I got to today.