Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

[Laurentius]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

When I quoted "basalt" I was referring to my thread concerning basalt.
BTW what did you mean weh you brought up Artemus Ward?

The quote thats at the bottom of your page, thats ends with, I forgot who said that. He said that.

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Aha mate! Thank you very much . I though you were wondering why I quoted "basalt", not telling me something I forget about my quote .
Thanks for telling me who said that. I once had the sensation that there should be someone on the forum to know who did. It was you. Interesting.
PS: Although now I know who said that, I may leave my quote intact. After I wrote it for the first time it looked awkward to me for a while forgetting who said that, then I found it interesting, and decided to go with it as it reflects a part of my personality that intentionally involves some fun into formal talks.

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Finally,

Insulation firebricks delivered to home, after weeks of struggle to bring the right materials. I managed to deliver 3 bags of clay just in case.

Mates,

The supplier told me that they mix 2:1-clay:cement. This doesn't comply with the 3:1:1:1-sand:clay:cement:lime that I was educated here. Any comments on the 2:1 formula?

To be honest, all ovens built with this formula have been running fine in restaurants for years here.

[stonecutter]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Finally,

Insulation firebricks delivered to home, after weeks of struggle to bring the right materials. I managed to deliver 3 bags of clay just in case.

Mates,

The supplier told me that they mix 2:1-clay:cement. This doesn't comply with the 3:1:1:1-sand:clay:cement:lime that I was educated here. Any comments on the 2:1 formula?

To be honest, all ovens built with this formula have been running fine in restaurants for years here.

How many portions of sand?

[Tscarborough]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

None, that is similar to the one I talked about the other day that the old school masons laid up fireplaces with. It just has the Portland as a gauging material. I would assume they are parging the ovens after building them, like the Italians do with a pourable.

[stonecutter]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

Fine for fireplaces where the joint doesn't open up behind the face of the brick. I think a 2:1 with no sand is asking for major shrink cracks....I'm finding it hard to believe there is no aggregate in the mix beyond the clay.

[Tscarborough]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

I have not been able to determine exactly what the Italians use in the pourable parge, but I am sure it contains aggregate. I didn't say I agree with it, Italian or old school, but that is what they do and have been doing for a very long time.

[stonecutter]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

You mean like what the Neapolitans pour onto the dome? I was thinking that there is fine sand in a very rich refractory mix...I can't know for sure either, without seeing it in person. I'm pretty confident it isn't only Portland and clay though.

[Tscarborough]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

No, the fireclay or fireclay/portland is used to lay the brick (the Italians use some scoria as aggregate in this), then a pourable refractory mix is used. My best guess for the mix is:

1/2 fireclay
10-20% pozzolans
20-40% scoria.

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

After that, could you tell me if I can follow the 2:1 formula?

[stonecutter]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

No, the fireclay or fireclay/portland is used to lay the brick (the Italians use some scoria as aggregate in this), then a pourable refractory mix is used. My best guess for the mix is:

1/2 fireclay
10-20% pozzolans
20-40% scoria.

Being very traditional, I wonder if any of them are using calcium aluminate as a pozzolan. It appears that they use modern refractory for the pourable infill cladding...hard to say not seeing them in person.

[cobblerdave]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

G'day
Would the fact that these ovens are in constant use and remain heated if not fired have a bearing?
When I think about it our "weekend " usage of our ovens must be hard on them. They sit in the open mostly and take up moisture. They are flashed up from a cold state up tho pizza temp.
A commercial used oven is out of the elements and the heat shock from a still warm oven to pizza temperatures is not as great a shock?
Just a thought
Regards dave

[v12spirit]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

G'day
Would the fact that these ovens are in constant use and remain heated if not fired have a bearing?

That makes sense. Actually the 3:1:1:1 formula is more economic for a tight person like me. I just thought the 2:1 formula has some advantages over the 3:1:1:1 formula. It doesn't look to have anymore.
I was surprised when I once saw a tandoor oven builder building the entire tandoor with just clay smashed with jute threads and meal salt! I wonder how these things bear heat without even cracking.

[stonecutter]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

G'day
Would the fact that these ovens are in constant use and remain heated if not fired have a bearing?

On what exactly, Dave?

[cobblerdave]

Re: Brick oven reconstructed to a steel one

G'day
Sorry for the late reply
Weren't we discussing the mortar mix? I was wondering if the constant use oven could have different mortar as it was subject to lowere level of thermal shocks than our weekender ovens?
Regards dave