Pizza History in the Hammer Continues

[Neil.B]

Well done Barry, looking forward to it taking shape. Its looking great so far.

[Chach]

Glad to hear your moving forward. I used a miter saw and swapped my wood blade for a diamond blade. Once I found the degree I was all good to get rid of that nasty inverted V. Try and keep your non full width bricks out of the view of the oven opening. You will get a better look when you look inside the oven...this part is just aesthetics. Looking good!

Ricky

[Baza]

UPDATE: POSITIVE!

I asked for strength and got it!
GreenViews ideas regarding measuring to the brick edge from dead centre to find the part to shave and -Chach 's suggestion above (and reviewing his build) about shaving a couple of bricks at a time 1/2 way WORKED (see pics) dry lay is FANTASTIC!

I laid a brick, then another beside it, noted the inverted V - laid metal meter stick from dead centre to edge of brick where inverted V was - eyeballed the line along the ruler to about mid-brick and drew a line
Removed the brick and drew a line straight down to the nearest corner on the face - this gave me the small piece to shave off
Shimmed and lined the brick up on the saw - cut and placed back - worked a charm! Did other bricks to see if I was on to something - I was - all worked out (See pics)
Took ages to get to this point and figure something that could work for me - I was ecstatic!!

So - after a long afternoon of figuring and testing - only time left to build arch template and measure/place it
Tomorrow (pending rain) will lay arch, mortar newly cut course and declared victory on a confident next few steps!

Been a day ----

[Baza]

DISASTER!

I built Chipster's jig and dowloaded deejayoh's spreadsheet. BOTH are FANTASTIC!
I tuned in the angles and cut a couple of bricks - wow - awesome!
They lined up perfect with NO gaps in a dry fit! Delighted - I cut some other already cut bricks to correct them and put them in place (see pic)

Today, went out excited to finish dry-laying the 4th course and started cutting - what the HELL HAPPENED!?
My cuts were on the exact same set up - nothing moved - but, as you can see from the pics, the beveling and angling was causing the course to RISE from the one below!
How can it work 12 hours earlier and be a disaster today???

Warping
I looked at the top board in the jig and you can see (yellow line in pic) that the board warped. So as I was cutting - flipping over 180 degrees as suggested - it was not producing a similar bevel or angle and caused the gapping as I moved the brick across the warped jig!
I am gutted ---

Thought to rebuild the jig with a 2x6 instead of 3/4 ply and varathane it to protect it - but the 2x6 doesn't create enough clearance for my 10" saw!
I'm a complete disaster - I'm really bummed

ChachRandyJ I think I may not continue with the jig as it is providing me no end of headaches and my first 3 courses were built without it - to use the exact measurements now may not reflect the build I've been doing and should probably take your approaches to bevelling 1/2 bricks a few at a time for fit (Utah's indicated that he, too, would not have gone the pure route if doing again)

I will eyeball from a level and shim the brick to get the angle and not get caught up in jigs and the like as they are really slowing me down (AWESOME as they ARE!)

Here are some pics of the disaster - now off to try a couple of bricks from level and shims and then attempt the arch build ---- give me strength
Barry

[Chach]

Thank you gentlemen!
I'm SO grateful for your support and help to see where to put my efforts.

Neil.B thank you for your ideas - I noticed the same - when I put an angled/beveled (or at least my attempt at it) against a flat uncut brick - it narrowed the inverted V greatly - this may be a hack when things go wrong from time to time (and they will! )

RandyJUtahBeehiver yes - I have had much guidance on this and many indicated doing a bevel cut only (if they were to do it again) and dummy me mistook bevel for angle. So, now that I get that the bevel is the cut vertically Not horizontally that allows the bricks to squeeze up against each other as the rings tighten - I see that I need to work on HOW to make such cuts (angle cuts are easier given the brick is lying flat - bevels are harder and need a jig of some kind to get the proper bevel angle (how do I do that??)

Much to work on for the upcoming weekend!
Hoping to get the Arch sorted and build so that I can close the sides of the oven against it.
Wish me luck! (and any supportive ideas on approaches to both FINDING and CUTTING the bevel - I'm all ears!!)

Take care everyone
Barry

I used a compound miter saw with a diamond blade to make the inverted v go away. I didn't bevel the whole brick I just did the first 1/2" because I didn't taper the brick anyway so putting a full bevel on the brick didn't matter. I just put a brick in the IT set it without mortar and shimmed it so I can take a level and mark a straight line on both sides of the face and went to the miter saw and set the angle on the saw and made sure it was cut straight with the line and if not I adjusted it until it was. I then did 2 bricks this way and set them with mortar and if it worked I continued cutting that same angle for the course. Once the saw it set you can cut both sides of the brick by rotating the brick.


Ricky

[deejayoh]

Hoping to get the Arch sorted and build so that I can close the sides of the oven against it.
Wish me luck! (and any supportive ideas on approaches to both FINDING and CUTTING the bevel - I'm all ears!!)

Check out this post on how to make a Jig https://community.fornobravo.com/for...-table?t=16780

And this spreadsheet will calculate the angles: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

[RandyJ]

All i did was use brick cut offs as shims to get the angle for the bevel i was looking for. I wish I had a better explanation for you but I typically just do things by eye at work and it works nicely for me. That is what experience gives you. I am use to bending conduit at work so am fairly good at judging angles and distance. Good luck.

Randy

[Baza]

Thank you gentlemen!
I'm SO grateful for your support and help to see where to put my efforts.

Neil.B thank you for your ideas - I noticed the same - when I put an angled/beveled (or at least my attempt at it) against a flat uncut brick - it narrowed the inverted V greatly - this may be a hack when things go wrong from time to time (and they will! )

RandyJUtahBeehiver yes - I have had much guidance on this and many indicated doing a bevel cut only (if they were to do it again) and dummy me mistook bevel for angle. So, now that I get that the bevel is the cut vertically Not horizontally that allows the bricks to squeeze up against each other as the rings tighten - I see that I need to work on HOW to make such cuts (angle cuts are easier given the brick is lying flat - bevels are harder and need a jig of some kind to get the proper bevel angle (how do I do that??)

Much to work on for the upcoming weekend!
Hoping to get the Arch sorted and build so that I can close the sides of the oven against it.
Wish me luck! (and any supportive ideas on approaches to both FINDING and CUTTING the bevel - I'm all ears!!)

Take care everyone
Barry

[UtahBeehiver]

Agree that an angle (aka as a taper) cut is not needed but a bevel will be necessary to minimize what is called an inverted "V" mortar joint which appear in the upper courses.

[RandyJ]

Hey there Baza , if i were you i would not bother with the angle on the bricks. It makes it greatly more difficult for no real advantage.

[Neil.B]

Barry, I know it's hard but try not to worry and overthink. I know it looks lovely in pictures to get the perfect joint, but everyone will appreciate the work you have put in even if there is slight imperfections.
My build is all over the place as the bricks are slightly different heights due to my poor cutting skills(cutting one brick in to six). I'm still amazed how it is turning out, especially once the dome starts curving.

It might sound a silly question, but are the bricks with the inverted v up the right way? You could also try putting a non cut brick next to the angled cut. It won't be perfect but the gap should close more.

Neil

[Chach]

Looking great! You are going to love seeing your stack of bricks transform to the dome.

Ricky

[Baza]

Hello Forno Friends and welcoming input!!

Dino_Pizza First - thanks to you for your support and help by sharing your drawings!!! Incredibly kind, supportive and clear!

Well things went well on second course - happy with outcome and content with the joints - trying to keep them tight.
Then off to the 3rd course - noticed inverted V's in the dry stack.UtahBeehiver and many others indicated this would start happening around here and there would need to be a plan!
Many also mentioned the they would, if doing it again, not do complicated compound cuts and just bevel the first few inches in on each side ... so I took the advice.

GreenViews Thanks to you for your straight-edge method of calculating the bevel cut! I think it worked well (though I could not understand how you got the vertical? I get how you got the bevel, but how did you get the vertical to get the angle cut that made the trapezoid!?). I didn't do a trapezoid ... thinking the bevel was enough. I started by laying 4 bricks and it seemed to go ok - then noticed even these start to show an inverted V!!!?? (see last picture)

I don't know what is up.
I haven't cut an angle - just the bevel.
I'm trying to minimize cuts (ie/ not an angle - but I think I need to given the impending V's I'm starting to see!).

I just don't know how to confidently figure out how to do the angle to go with the bevel! ANY help here would be welcome!
(NOTE: I know of the famous "Dome Spreadsheet" but I do not have a jig - should I? - and it seems profoundly beyond me!)
If trapezoids are in my future - I could use a bit of help to learn how!

Thanks friends
Barry

[Baza]

HELLO Forno Friends!!

Been a while since I've worked/updated!! I'm a high school principal and back-to-school has been HECTIC preparing all the protocols for school return and safety! WOW!
Miss working on the oven - but did get at it and started laying it down!
I know these are the easiest 2 courses as they are just 1/2 bricks - but it really is a nice intro to using one's saw, IT, mortar mixing for consistency and watching it start to rise!

So far so good - I know it's going to get weirder!

Hope everyone is well!
Barry

[Dino_Pizza]

Hi Barry,
Great job so far!, I'll second what Ricky said above about shortening your measuring arm so it won't press against the brick row below. You seem to be spending the correct amount of time planning and double checking things before you start mortaring in place and that is great.

I did not do a hemisphere, I did a squished parabola which meant adjusting the IT tool distance for most rows. Even with a hemisphere, be prepared for minor adjustments because it is so, so easy to let the dome height "get away from you" as you mortar things in. Dry stacking as you are doing doesn't include the mortar that gets into the inner dome bricks. I tried to have next to nothing on the inside (hoping to mortar in only the V-shape or Pie-shape areas from the outside) but... some always gets in. And you DO want some morter on all 4 sides of the brick, its what gives your dome strength, its just hard to keep the inside thin.

I was shooting for a 19.75" inner dome height on my 42" wide oven, and it finished at 20.5 but I was ruthless on my 4th and 5th rows to start bringing it over. You will be amazed at how much craft and technical skill you will develop after 2 rows and it will get easier.

cheers, Dino