Acoma 42" Tuscan

[Acoma]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

OK, I share the concerns. The outside dome does not look dramatic, although a picture of the outside of the dome tomorrow will likely help with the visual. I have only been aggressive with course 4,5,6. I have not started 7.

Yes, if experts on the mortar subject can interject, that would be great. I would hope that the hard work is not in vain.

I will also show a sample brick with gap. What I can do is to change the plan from 20 inch goal, and go with tapering the back gap, going from the large back to .75 on the next two courses to .50 for the remaining, or is there a smarter idea.

[jcg31]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Robert, I share RT's concern, which is why I asked the question a couple nights ago. I am absolutely no expert, but we have plenty here on site. I think you should ask them to weigh in before you go much further. You have been killing yourself and I would hate for you to have to retrace too many of your courses if there is a problem.

I used your measurements to create the attached drawing and then extended what you had done to 20". It just occurs to me that there is going to be a ton (literally) of weight resting on those wide joints. Hope I am wrong.

Jim

[RTflorida]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Truly; please just don't mention L3, L4, and L5 - I'm certain my back will seize up just reading about them.

[gjbingham]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

This is starting to sound like cervical spinal surgery. Way too complicated for me. I'm limited to oral surgery and sloppy dome building.

[RTflorida]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Hey Robert,
just trying to visualize and certainly not being critical but I have to ask:

The gaps on the outside are actually 1 1/8" between C4, 5 ,6,7,8, and 9???
I didn't realize you were going so steep, your pics don't really show it. Can you post a pic or two of the outside of the dome?
You're really doing excellent work and all looks terrific, but I would be lying if I said I wasn't concerned about those outer gaps (I'm sure you have considered this). You may be venturing into uncharted waters here...I can't remember anyone trying such a steep transition. I hope your mortar holds up....hurry up and finish and fire this puppy up - REALLY curious about these mortar gaps and potential cracking.
Again, I wish you the best with this design, hate to see any issues after all of the tedious planning and meticulous work you have put in.

RT

[Acoma]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

You don't want to know. Well, I know I will hear plenty but it has been my decision in order to accomplish my end goal.

Done:
C1-solder, no gap
C2-no gap, straight up
C3- .50 inches
C4- 1 1/8th inches
C5- 1 1/8th inches
C6- 1 1/8th inches
To Do:
C7- 1 1/8th inches (this would get me to 21 even)
C8- 1 1/8th inches (this would get me to 20.25)
C9- 1 inch (Goal of 20)
C10- ? (Goal of 20)
C11- ? (Goal of 20)
C12- ? (Goal of 20)
C13- ? (Goal of 20)

Now you know the gaps and goals. Lay it on me I will find out the performance, cracks, success and failures by this. I just like the larger brick look; I don't want the beveled bricks that shorten them.

[RCLake]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Jim, I finished the cuts for 1/2's for course 7. I angle cut one side, and I will wait to bevel the other until I do my measurements for each piece. After that, more cutting

As for accurate measurements from center point to top of each course brick:

C1- 22.25
C2- 22.50
C3- 23
C4- 23
C5- 22.5
C6- 21.75

C7 on will be more gradual I believe. I will see what consistent height is needed in the backs to get to 20 now.

Robert, if you are using the full height to the brick for each row (no tapering the bottom) How much of a gap do you at the back end of the brick. I've been lifting mine up with either a 1/4" or 3/8" piece of plywood.

[Acoma]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Jim, I finished the cuts for 1/2's for course 7. I angle cut one side, and I will wait to bevel the other until I do my measurements for each piece. After that, more cutting

As for accurate measurements from center point to top of each course brick:

C1- 22.25
C2- 22.50
C3- 23
C4- 23
C5- 22.5
C6- 21.75

C7 on will be more gradual I believe. I will see what consistent height is needed in the backs to get to 20 now.

[Acoma]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Jim, sorry I did not respond to the question about angle. The angle has been the same for several courses. You are finally seeing it now. I check the angle and distance after each course to be sure I am on track to be at approximately 20" by finish. I only wish for the curved dome, realizing the base from center was 22.5, then 23+ after 2 straight courses. This is amateur at best. I will measure the distance from center with 6 done and let you know where I am at. I kind of figure 12 courses to completion with full thickness of bricks?

Frances, I believe the transition photos of 5 and 6 are there, as well as completion shots of each course. I do agree that it helps future builders too.

[Frances]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Wow, looking at your pictures takes me right back! Don't you love it when the dome starts closing in like that? I wish I could build another oven sometime...

The dome looks great, and I really like the second picture, it shows how you're tying in the dome and archway beautifully. Did you put that one in the photo gallery yet? I'm sure it would be really helpful to future oven builders.

[Acoma]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

James, vibration is nothing compared to numbness of fingers. Getting into the tent, my hands go straight to the warm water soaking bricks when this happens.

As for the oven, I take building it very serious. I do that with all projects, and find that all of past project results come out above expectations. I am very confident I will love this oven. Building it is tough, and I mean tough- for winter time and room constraints. What the heck, a promise is a promise. To my daughter, and oven by spring.

[james]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

... as for wet saw usage. Most recent usage was in the 20's. My hands were freezing, and I was quick to cut and get back into the tent. Likely it was the coldest of times with it.

This is pretty serious stuff Robert. I'm having trouble picturing numb from vibration and numb from cold at the same time. Did your hands really tingle when they thawed out?

I really (really) hope you like your oven when it's done. :-)
James

[jcg31]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Ahh much better photo of it. A bit of engineering expertise in keeping those ears up as well. And the kids! easy to predict gray hairs for you in about 13 years.

It looks like you made a big change in slope or angle in your last course (like a change of 20-25 degrees from your photos) are you going for a bit of a flatter dome ceiling?

Jim

[Acoma]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Sarah, I have done everything freehand. No support for arch or dome. It has been insane at times, but I feel more confident doing it this way. For the arch, my support was only to hold the pieces in place after I was done, a temporary support. As for the dome, I have a tool I aquired from JC Jim, and this can be an option later as the circles tighten. If not, I will go by hand. I figure I can do it because of the arch.

Jim, the sculpure is my wife. The snow was what we call out west "Sierra Sement", very moist and sticky. Not favorable for skiing or boarding, but great for making snowbunnies. My wife and the girls had an awesome time. Guess where I was while it was going on? Yep, working on the oven. I was able to hear them laughing while it was going on. For some of you, a better view of the fun.

RC, as for wet saw usage. Most recent usage was in the 20's. My hands were freezing, and I was quick to cut and get back into the tent. Likely it was the coldest of times with it.

[sarah h]

Re: Acoma 42" Tuscan

Robert,

I had not been keeping up with things in the past while and am amazed at how far along your oven is! And I love your arch transition - beautiful work, as is the rest of it! Hang in there - it's got to be tough working on this through the winter but you'll soon be at the point where the arch is behind you and the rows get smaller, quicker! Do you plan to use a form as the rows get higher?

Sarah